I’m with the school board guy on this one.
I never know if posts about stories like this are going to cause big fights in the comment thread or make people tell me I’m full of shit because I don’t have kids and thus should shut up, but that never stopped me before so here goes.
A Des Moines mother says she is “mortified” by a school board member’s letter to her son that challenges the young athlete to work hard but also contains a slang reference to a sex act.
Craig Richman, 16, a sophomore wrestler at Roosevelt High School, wrote an e-mail to school board members last week that voiced his frustration with the state’s “no pass, no play” rule, which benches athletes whose grades slip.
Richman blamed his academic struggles on advanced math classes. He said it was unfair that he should be required to sit out for six weeks for “challenging myself” and added that he is retaking the algebra class that gave him trouble.
Board member Jonathan Narcisse, one of three board members to respond to Richman, said Monday that he thought the teen needed some “tough love.”
His e-mail told Richman: “Suck it up, man. Hit the books. Work out, and stay in shape, and don’t make the same mistake ever again.”
Richman’s parents feel Narcisse’s 11-paragraph e-mail was unnecessarily harsh. But they are more upset with a story Narcisse shared with the teen about an athlete who hadn’t focused enough on his academics and was last seen at a convenience store “asking customers for money for wine and offering (oral sex) for money.”
Kim Richman, Craig’s mother, said the e-mail was offensive and demeaning.
“It was not something you should be getting from somebody who you should consider a role model, somebody who is on the school board,” she said.
…Craig Richman said Narcisse’s sexual reference made him a little uncomfortable, but he was more upset with Narcisse’s lack of help on the issue and telling him “life isn’t fair” and to “suck it up.”
“He shouldn’t be saying things like that,” Craig Richman said. “He’s on the school board and is supposed to be a role model and give words of encouragement.”
Well. Let’s investigate this more fully. At the link, over on the right side of the page, is the full text of the kid’s email and the school board member’s reply. Read them both before commenting, I beg you.
And let me say that of course Narcisse shouldn’t have used the phrase “blow jobs” in an email to a high-school student. That was dumb and he could have made his point without saying something that would give the precious snowflake’s parents good reason to say he crossed a line. That said, however…
Excerpts from the kid’s email:
First to start things off, I want to tell you that I failed my algebra 2 class second semester last school year (Because of this I am now ineligible for 6 weeks for the next sport I play.).
Now I would like to explain what I disagree with about the 6 week rule. I honestly don’t think it’s fair that I have to sit out for some of my wrestling season for “challenging myself.”
I believe if you say I have to still sit for wrestling season for failing a 2 year advanced class ( That I am retaking this year), then you apparently don’t care that much about the education of kids, because then I’ll take this as you pretty much saying that you don’t want kids to challenge themselves. Now is this true? I honestly hope not since you are the school board but, if I still sit for wrestling season, then ill think way more poorly of the school system.
All I know is this kid obviously doesn’t do all that well in English class, either. But that’s okay. I won’t judge him (except that I will, while claiming I won’t, because I’m judgmental that way). The point is, if you read the comments on the article, some of which are from people familiar with the school, you’ll see that the “advanced” class is no such thing and is required of all students, and that the kid chose to take it early; he didn’t have to.
So maybe he was “challenging” himself. Well guess what Scooter, when you take on challenges, that often involves risk. Good lesson to learn.
And now for pretty much the entire “offensive”, “demeaning”, “harsh” email from the school board member that was so “upsetting” for the poor boy’s parents:
This is a good rule. Perhaps it isn’t tough enough. You are a student athlete and your first priority needs to be your academics.
Playing sports is a privilege not a right.
If you were to become a pro athlete your playing days are numbered. If you expect to be a college athlete your eligibility will be directly linked to your academics.
And if your sports career ends in high school your academic success is even more important.
You need to ask yourself what you need to do to be a better student. Life isn’t fair. The world isn’t fair. What if you were able to compete and suffered a devastating injury. What favor would we have done you?
No, instead of complaining about the tough rules, which by the way apply to everyone, you need to suck it up, ask what help you can get to be a better student and then focus on more than meeting the minimum but ask what can you do to truly excel in the classroom.
I remember this great athlete in high school names Randy. The adults let him slide by. Last time I saw him he was at the Git N Go gas station on Keo asking customers for money for wine and offering blow jobs for money. It was very sad because he had world class athletic talent. So much so that no one told him what I’m telling you now.
He didn’t make it in college because they didn’t let him slide and now his life is a shambles.
Robert Johnson, the first freshmen to ever start basketball in the Metro, had all these adults falling all over him. For four years he slid by. Then when he got to Iowa State he couldn’t cut it. Period. And all that God given talent was wasted and none of the adults that made it easy for him rescued him once he failed.
So suck it up man. Hit the books. Work out and stay in shape and don’t make the same mistake ever again.
This may seem like tough love but it’s the best advice you could get in this matter.
Someone explain to me where he is wrong (except of course for saying “blow jobs”). Am I crazy or isn’t this precisely the sort of thing more adults should be saying to more kids? Isn’t this the perfect antidote to all the useless coddling most kids get, which turns them into adults who can’t deal with reality?
Hell. I think this guy should be appointed Secretary of Education.
And by the way. All these people so upset about the “blow jobs” reference? Are they the same people who support graphic sex education in schools, the kind that tells kids all about “alternative activities” to avoid pregnancy? That’d be interesting to know.
I’m just saying, this Narcisse fellow is right on. About everything. My mom is a college professor at a private university and has appalling stories to tell about the student athletes and how entitled they feel, how they think the rules don’t apply to them, and how poorly many of them perform. They don’t realize that the chances of going pro are so slim that it’s not even funny, and that their college education is orders of magnitude more important. A lot of them needed to hear - and understand - years ago what Narcisse is telling this Craig kid now.
And my sister is head of the honors math department at a huge public high school in an affluent suburb and she has appalling stories to tell about parents and how everyone always wants the rules bent for their little angels. She told me this weekend that there is actually a big deal going on now about how if a student isn’t ready for a test on the test day, they should be allowed to take it later, for full credit. Good grief.
Again. We are seeing the future. It’s scary.
I’m sure the Snowflake had never even heard of a blow job before. That rapscallion, who does he think he is telling a kid the truth?
And I second the nomination to Secretary of Education.
Funny this comes on the heels of the article (last week?) about the current generation and self-esteem oriented schooling going to far.
November 19th, 2008 at 12:26 pmESTIt seems to me that the kid’s argument about “challenging Himself” by taking Algebra II early fell apart when he siad that the school, and not he chose to put him in advanced math some years ago.
Aside from the term ‘blow job’ I back most of what the school board member wrote. I have seen athletes (including an All American running back on my high school team) fail miserabley in college.
November 19th, 2008 at 12:27 pmESTI was a teaching assistant in grad school at one of Texas’ very large public universities. The entitlement of some of the regular students was appalling (and they were right around my age). I actually had some of them come up to me, say they didn’t want to bother to come to campus at the time I had my office hours, and want me to hold extra office hours when convenient for them, which would be all sorts of weird hours. They would actually say “I don’t want to come to campus then so can you meet me…” These were large classes but they wanted special treatment and were quite willing to inconvenience me so they could sit on their ass in their dorm room.
And the parents cause this. This school had a summer “provisional” program where those who weren’t accepted but weren’t rejected outright could take 12 hours the summer before their freshman year and if they got a certain GPA they’d be accepted. One summer a student was clearly not going to make it, but this student was willing to accept that fact. Her parent, A STATE POLITICIAN, however, was not. I’d better stop now…
November 19th, 2008 at 12:27 pmESTWhile I agree that the BJ reference was inappropriate, the gist of the letter was spot-on.
If only we had many more school board members like this one, we’d be doing so much better.
I’ll also add that the kid needs some help with grammar STAT. I’m sure he composed that letter and reviewed it before sending it; hopefully, his parents did the same. How could they let such a poorly-written letter go out?
The nuns would’ve cracked my knuckles for that.
November 19th, 2008 at 12:30 pmESTI luv it, but doesn’t the period usually go inside the paren?
I wonder how the paper decided which dots to leave in and which ones to redact. They seem to be taking sides.
I also wonder if somebody, somewhere in this exchange is desperately in need of a blowjob and may not be aware of it.
November 19th, 2008 at 12:31 pmESTWell, I don’t know what the rules are in Des Moines, but here in the great land of Oh-Hi-Yo, you have to have AT LEAST a 2.0 (”C”) average in the previous grading period to be eligible to play a school sport.
2.0
Advanced placement class, or not, that should be attainable for any normal-functioning, conscious student. And if he fell below that threshold, it could not have been a complete surprise. Did he not notice his test/quiz grades were bad?
I’m a coach, AND the father of an athlete, and I agree 100% with Rachel — this is the best advice the kid is likely to get. He needs to take responsibility for his failure. If he’s willing to take responsibility for choosing to take the class, he’s got to take responsibility for failing to make the grade.
Suck it up.
November 19th, 2008 at 12:32 pmESTWow. I wish my high school had that stance on sports back in the day. (tiny Christian school whose focus was all on student-athletes. Ridiculous, but then again, the students usually also got good grades as an afterthought to the sports.)
The school is in the right here. Academics come first.
However, that paragraph about the former athlete should have been left out, just in case. Maybe he should have talked to the student outside of a recordable medium if he wanted to share TMI.
Schools, media, and parents are all contributing to a “ME” culture with our kids. They think they deserve special treatment and should be passed on just because. No hard work necessary. This kid took on a higher level math course. Ok, that’s good. He failed it. He’s taking it again. Fine, but he still failed it and thus, should suffer the consequences. Athletics should be second, not first.
November 19th, 2008 at 12:36 pmESTGot kids. Agree 100%. I could be mistaken, but I’ve always thought that the notions of personal responsibility, reward for skill and effort, and the reality of dealing with mistakes were more or less the point of sports.
November 19th, 2008 at 12:43 pmESTAs a parent, your article is spot on.
Heh. I got that kind of talk from my own parents regarding how difficult it is to go into pro sports. Minus the blow job reference, of course.
November 19th, 2008 at 12:47 pmESTI went over to the Des Moines page and the article itself was crazy. However, what I found even more disturbing was that half of the response posts were for Craig, essentially calling Narcisse a big meany. What kind of pond scum world do these piles of prehistoric frog shit live in?
I agree with Rachel. The future does indeed look very scary.
November 19th, 2008 at 12:53 pmESTNNTG, the period only goes inside the paren when an entire sentence is inside the paren.
November 19th, 2008 at 12:57 pmESTNarcissistic, spoiled pansy.
Back when I was child (and no, dinosaurs did not rule the Earth then), I acted right because I knew that if I screwed up, the school would punish me AND call my mom, who would punish me even, too. Now, lots of parents are calling their lawyers when little Johnnie/Debbie gets in trouble. Fuck. That Noise.
My son played soccer this past year. It wasn’t school related, but I told him that he’d better not screw up in school or I’d pull him out of the league and let him tell his teammates how he had let them down. I’ve also been teaching him to be a good winner and a good loser. He knows that if he EVER taunts an opponent that his soccer season is over.
My point? Ignoring the blow job comment, the rest of the reply was dead on. Playing sports is a privilege, not a right. I’ve seen too many parents browbeat teachers into passing their darling little delinquents so that sports didn’t suffer. Not in my house, though. I will yank my kids off of team for being academic deadbeats faster than my blood pressure went up reading that little shit’s whiny reply to the tough love comment.
“But it’s not fair.”
Please, do the rest of us a favor and have a nice tall glass of STFU.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:02 pmESTFor crying out loud, he’s a wrestler. There’s no pro career at stake here - pro wrestling is nothing but acting.
If this kid thinks he doesn’t need school, he’d better resign himself to his position in Obama’s new middle class, formerly known as poor slackers. He might also consider that wine and head selling job - wrestling will surely have taught him to be comfortable with groping other men.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:03 pmESTI agree - Narcisse should be appointed Secretary of Education. And also cloned, so that he can teach in schools all over the country. I actually wish someone had given me that kind of talk when I was a teenager; I wasn’t in sports, but I was a lazy student and full of excuses, and for the most part nobody called me on that.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:07 pmESTO/T, but everybody note today is National Ammo Day.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:08 pmESTDuring a practice I was approached by the parent of one of my soccer players who wanted to know why he wasn’t getting more time on the field. I tried to explain the most dipolmatic way that I could when we were interrupted by the young man who had become embarassed by her protestations.
He turned to her and said in a loud voice “Because I suck mom, because I suck”
I looked at his mom and replied, “What he said”
November 19th, 2008 at 1:09 pmESTFeh. So he took Algebra II in 9th grade instead of 10th like most students. In order to be allowed to do that, he had to have already taken the prerequisites, which here in Texas are Algebra I and geometry. If he took the prereqs and passed them, then why the hell should anyone have any sympathy with him taking Alg II “early”? It’s not early if he’s already had the prereqs. It’s only “early” in the sense that it’s before most other students. In the scheme of what that precious darling had already taken, Alg II was NOT early or advanced or any crap like that. What difference could it have made to wait one more year? He’d have likely been worse off because he’d have started forgetting things.
It’s not like with science classes, where taking physics before having more advanced math classes is much harder. The reason students typically wait until 11th or 12th grades to take physics is so they have the chance to take the underpinning math classes. There is no earthly reason to wait to take Alg II if you’ve already taken Alg I and geometry.
This kid sounds like a great big freaking titty baby.
The blow job reference was not wise, since it gives titty baby’s parents something to legitimately gripe about, instead of focusing on the heart of the message, which, as Narcisse put it so well, is to SUCK IT UP!
I saw nothing in the kid’s email about how hard he worked on the class, or how he got tutoring, or how much he struggled with the class. Nothing about his teacher vouching for his efforts to pass. Just “it’s not faaaaaaaaaair.”
Somebody call the wahmbulance.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:14 pmESTso, I ‘m still stuck on why the kid is emailing some guy on the school board. Mostly stuck on the fact he’s calling the guy a “role model”. Huh? When I was in high school, I wouldn’t have been able to tell you what a school board was, let alone who was on it or how many positions there were. How the fuck is some guy on the school board a role model? I don’t get it. Aren’t parents role models? mmm… rolls.
Also, I agree with Suck It Up. No one likes to be told No, but to get all whiney about it is just embarassing.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:18 pmESTRachel? Did you really think that your commenters would be on the whiny kid’s side on this? I guess with this blog thing you just never know. But of course we are a bunch of heartless redneck gun toting right wing bastards so really you shouldn’t be surprised.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:23 pmESTNow, I wasn’t a school athlete, but I WAS spoiled by my mother in that she never really made me do anything. She could guilt me into doing things sometimes, but mostly I was allowed to get away with being a slothful little mole who hardly ever did any work, school or otherwise. I’m wayyyy younger than my two siblings, and she thought that she had been too hard on them, so I got away with murder. Of course, the fact that I was naturally a little, quiet boy who spoke intelligently to adults (but I didn’t talk all that much, either) and wasn’t a little hellraiser probably made it harder for her to say anything to me when I wasn’t doing what she wanted me to.
DAMN, I hate that now. I cannot seem to motivate myself to do anything half the time, so I hardly ever finish anything, don’t keep my house very clean, and am not very good at keeping MY children on the straight and narrow.
In other words, I’ll also second the nomination of Narcisse for Secretary of Education.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:27 pmESTNarcisse’s letter to the kid:
November 19th, 2008 at 1:27 pmESTAlso a Bitter Childless Woman Who Should Probably Shut Up about Teh Kidz, but:
except for the BJ reference, the letter was spot on.
What we need to do in this nation is to stop the Special Snowflake train in its tracks. A lot of the problems we have might be solved by a populace that was better at saying, “Well, that sucks, but that’s how things are” rather than “ME ME ME I’m special I DESERVE it gimme dat special treatment NOW”
I have student-athletes in my classes. Some are good, some not so much. It comes down, IMHO, to the coaches - in one sport, the coach makes EVERYONE practice longer and harder if ONE student has unexcused absences. He benches people if they fail a test. In another sport, the coach doesn’t give a crap. He doesn’t respond to letters from faculty that say “WHERE is your student-athlete who has been enrolled in my class? He has been absent 10 out of the last 12 class periods and he is FAILING.” This same coach also seems to permit an entitlement mentality in his athletes…I had one in my class once who chronically missed quizzes and then expected that I would give him make-ups. Because he was Student Athlete.
I’m sorry, but being good at sports doesn’t make you a god. Better you learn that now than later.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:28 pmESTchickia:
there may be one or two dissenters who will actually post, but it seems like most just jam up Rachel’s email, since that’s the easy, passive-aggressive, nonconfrontational way to do things.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:30 pmESTI once knew a guy, taught high school back in the 80s, who had a great line he used to use with his slack-offer whiny kids. He’d probably get his ass fired for it today, but I thought it was brilliant.
He’d ask them (when they failed his class or something) whether they planned on working harder in the future. If he got anything less than a “Sir, yes sir!” from them, he’d say, “Because you know, if you don’t work hard in school, you will only need to know six words for the rest of your life: ‘Do you want fries with that?’”
November 19th, 2008 at 1:30 pmESTSharon,
Oh. You’re right, after I bothered to look it up.
So the rules for parens and quote marks are completely inconsistent with each other. (One can look that up, too.) Got it. Ain’t English grand?
November 19th, 2008 at 1:31 pmESTricki:
let me guess: “doesn’t give a crap coach” is coaching football? and “hard ass coach” is for track and field?
I come from a Pac10 school, so I know these things.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:33 pmESTMy little sister is the same age as him, and she’s taking Algebra II this year, one year ahead of most of her class. Her first progress report came back with her receiving a failing mark. You can sure as hell bet my parents didn’t codle her and have her write the school board and explain that since she does so many extra curricular activities and is always involved in theater and church groups that she shouldn’t be penalized for taking an advanced course. They told her to get her butt to the teacher and ask what she can do to bring that grade up. She was having trouble understanding the material, which was the primary reason for the failing grade. So now she takes time out of her extra curricular activities to study more and if she doesn’t understand something she asks for help from people (not me) who are good at math. She just got an A on her last test, and I have to say that to see her so proud of herself because she KNEW she worked for that grade and was very satisfying.
Doesn’t this mother see that she isn’t teaching her son skills that will serve him well in life by teaching him that even if you don’t work hard for something, you should be allowed to have it anyway?
November 19th, 2008 at 1:35 pmESTRicki, there’s a real demotivator for that one.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:35 pmESTAlso, I highly doubt the kid felt “uncomfortable” about the bj reference. His discomfort over it was probably at realizing, after his mother got upset about it, that he had another thing to complain about and could possibly use the inappropriate reference to get himself back onto the wrestling team.
Case in point: When I was in 7th grade, I had an English teacher who once, in a moment of sheer frustration at an asshat kid misbehaving in the back, finally said “Stop jacking off back there!” Some people laughed, everyone shrugged it off, comment forgotten. Two days later the teacher stood up in front of the class and said that she’d been thinking about it and realized that it was very innapropriate what she said the other day and that she wanted to apologize to the class for being so crude… she was met with mostly blank stares. No one in the class, including myself, could even remember what she’d said that was so bad. She had to remind us.
Kids in school hear a lot and a lot of it just passes over them without them thinking about it. I doubt that kid cared that the school board member used the term “blowjob”. I doubt that he even really noticed it, because I bet he hears it a lot from his idiot friends.
It probably wasn’t wise of the school board member to use that word, but nothing else he said to the kid was in the least bit inappropriate. It’s high time the kid learned responsibility for his actions.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:37 pmESTI have no problem with anything the school board member said, including the blow job reference. He shouldn’t have used it, because he should have been smart enough to know what the reaction was going to be. That would be the ONLY reason I would have for not using the term “blow job.”
November 19th, 2008 at 1:40 pmESTThe contents of the correspondence have been completely shoved aside because he mentioned a sex act. All people are going to know when they look at the headlines is that a school official mentioned a sex act during correspondence with a minor. People will be screaming for his head based on that fact, without regard for why the term was used or the context of the conversation.
This guy should be given a freakin’ MEDAL for his honesty and bravery. He obviously cares about this kid’s future enough to try to shake him up. The same cannot be said for the adults attempting to bubble-wrap the child and prevent his po’ widdle feewings fwum gettin’ a boo-boo. Feh.
I’m with the school board guy on this one. I don’t even think the bj reference was bad in this context. It’s certainly no worse than what the kid says and hears all the time in school and in this context it ought to scare the kid into getting good grades.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:41 pmESTNo, not THAT Glenn:
That is a truly awesome poster. I’m gonna post it on every college BB across the country. You will see me on CNN as the perpetrator of a hate crime, probably, but damn it would be worth it.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:41 pmESTThis kid’s parents are going to ruin him. I really commend the school board member who cared enough to tell it like it is.
I would be interested in hearing more stories from your mom and sister. That stuff fascinates me.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:50 pmESTY’all, we should be encouraged. Someone on the school board 1) was not an idiot, 2) actually couched his non-idiotic opinion in non-idiotic terms, 3) was willing to put it on (electronic) paper. That’s encouraging. Let’s hope he doesn’t get Joe-the-Plumber’d!
November 19th, 2008 at 1:55 pmESTI loved what the schoolboard member wrote. It’s like tough love without having to visit a jail.
When I was a CASA, I frequently spoke like this and guess what? The boys *listened* (miracle of miracles.)
November 19th, 2008 at 1:55 pmESTThat one’s been out a while. I recall when I first saw it, I thought of Girlchild working for McDonald’s and moonlighting at a DQ. She’s since moved up in the world. Now she works for WalMart. She had trouble with HS math. Which was disappointing as hell, considering Joyce was working on a Math major and carrying a full-load 4.0 when she decided to marry me instead of starting her Jr year. And expressed no interest in going back to school after that. I don’t know what that means.
November 19th, 2008 at 1:59 pmESTI want to know if there is some way we can let that school board guy know that some people in this nation support his words, since I’m sure he’ll be hearing lots of BAD! MEAN! EVIL! WRONG! HEARTLESS! OFF WITH HIS HEAD! MEAN! CRUEL! DIRTY OLD MAN! MEAN! WAH! MEAN!
November 19th, 2008 at 2:10 pmESTI hate those “student” athletes! Especially the football players. They are worst;)
[Ha ha, and also heh. In case anyone wonders, this "Carl" person here is a close friend of mine and was a college football player, and also has a higher IQ than most people I know combined. But he still sucks. "lol"
- Rachel]
November 19th, 2008 at 2:13 pmESTGood for the school board member. More teachers and education employees SHOULD treat kids like this. Suck it up. Life isn’t fair. That pretty much sums up my mom’s advise to me growing up.
November 19th, 2008 at 2:16 pmESTI’m going to disagree with everyone on this. First of all, I don’t consider the BJ reference wrong. The kid has heard worse.
HOWEVER the kid made two arguments, one valid but underdeveloped, and one utterly fallacious. The fallacious argument is “if you don’t let me ‘rassel I’ll hate you forever.” The correct response is, “Meh so.”
The valid argument is, “I failed a advanced, junior level class that I took while I was a freshman. Even if I fail this class again this year and don’t pass until I’m a junior my performance could be considered above average because the class is advanced. I could have taken freshman math for pot-heads and future janitors. I would have passed. However, I didn’t do that because academics are very important to me and I wanted to do more then the minimum. By removing my sports eligibility for failing a highly advanced class you give me a reason to take less challenging classes and thereby learn less. I feel this policy is counter-productive.”
The school board member replied, “Don’t expect us to pass you when you don’t desirve it because if we do you’ll end up, living on the street, giving BJs for money, while drunk out of your mind on Mad Dog 20/20.” This completely ignores both the kid’s points and that’s what I object to.
Now there are myriad reasons to keep the kid ineligible even if we assume his argument is completely convincing. For example 1) we can’t change the rules for just you, 2) we’ve looked at your records ad we think you would have passed this class had you not been in sports, 3) the eligibility rules are there to motivate you - motivation doesn’t come without penalties, 4) the lession you’ve just learned about scheduling and prioritizing your activites is more valuable then sports or an advanced math class. 5) etc. etc.
To not make any of those arguments, and instead respond with the unrelated party line, shows an attitude that would piss me off as well.
But the BJ, that’s fine.
November 19th, 2008 at 2:21 pmESTThe sad thing is that this board member will be voted out the next time he’s up for election. We know that.
This situation happens too often. I went to an relatively affluent public high school, and the crap kids got away with is unbelievable. Bunch of “student” athletes got busted for drinking at a formal by the police, and got slap on wrist because their parents were lawyers, doctors, etc and almost no suspension for athletics. Heck, my English teacher thought that the school was too hard on kids, and actually joked with those kids about drinking.
And blow job is so 6th grade. Those high school kids are probably doing more advanced stuff because they passed the “blow job” prerequisite.
November 19th, 2008 at 2:24 pmESTIf there’s one thing I can’t stand, it’s all of the concern about being politically correct all the time. I really don’t think that BJ comment was all that out of place- maybe not PC, but not out of place. Obvously, he was going for the shock factor. It worked, but probably against him.
You can’t honestly think the kid has never heard the term BJ or not be desensitized to terms of that nature. It wouldn’t surprise me one bit if he was already involved in such activities. Seems to me he’s just pissed at himself for his own failures, but needs someone else to lash out on.
November 19th, 2008 at 2:34 pmESTThe beauty of a small town, such as mine, is that the school board is made up of regular “joes.” While I agree that “blow job” probably shouldn’t have been referenced, I wholeheartedly back the school board member’s response.
I am one of those school board members just trying to protect my little corner of the world and make it safe from muslim etremists, the pc crowd, the unions and anything else that threatens our way of life.
My hat is off to that school board and itsmembers
November 19th, 2008 at 2:34 pmESTTo those commenters who are attempting to justify the BJ reference in the email with some variation of, “It’s not as if the kid probably hadn’t heard it before”: please stop. Granted, it’s not that big of a deal, but two wrongs do not make a right.
Other than that, as a parent I support and applaud everything Mr. Narcisse wrote. We need more educators like him. My relationship with my daughters’ schools has often felt adversarial to me because I was trying to teach them the points that Mr. Narcisse made while the schools were busy teaching them narcissistic entitlement.
Part of the reason for Craig Richman’s lack of success in his math class may be that he’s spending valuable study time coming up with excuses and emailing school board members with the “reasons” why they should make an exception for him instead of working algebra problems.
November 19th, 2008 at 2:42 pmESTGod help me, I’m supporting an admin of a public school. Zero tolerance, zero intelligence has some influence in this ruling and reaction but its all about the helicopter parents and the entitlement mentality. Also, David Krum, I don’t buy that argument about him being in a higher level course ahead of schedule should buy him any real consideration. If he’s not man enough by high school to take himself out of a class he’s failing or to hit the books, he needs to learn that lesson. It’ll save him grief later on in life. I didn’t really learn that lesson till college.
I agree with the idea that the BJ comment is only out of line because it will be used against him.
November 19th, 2008 at 2:48 pmESTWhen I was growing up, we couldn’t have dessert if we didn’t eat our dinner. Seems sort of the same: if you’re not passing a class, you don’t get to go out and play. The notion of delayed gratification seems to have gotten lost somewhere.
November 19th, 2008 at 2:49 pmESTThis is why it’s impossible to work in public schools. Anyone who has any self-worth should immediately quit and join the private sector.
November 19th, 2008 at 2:50 pmESTI’m still in shock that a school board exists that would give good common sense advice.
November 19th, 2008 at 2:52 pmESTMy kids are now in their thirties, and like all of us humans they made some mistakes growing up. A couple of the best moments of my parenting years came when I heard or overheard one of my kids say, “It was my own fault, and I have to pay the consequences,” or words to that effect.
Parents, when you hear those words you know you’re doing something right!
November 19th, 2008 at 2:53 pmESTMaya, you are half right. (about the football). The other coach…think different gender, larger ball….
November 19th, 2008 at 3:02 pmESTOh, the ad at the top is from the NCSA - national collegiate scouting association. I guess titty-baby bench sitter won’t have that happen any time soon…
November 19th, 2008 at 3:02 pmESTRachel puts her foo–I mean, 2 cents in
Since blowjobs are sort of in context, is that in a good or a — no, never mind.
“…college football player” and “…higher IQ” are not incompatible. In Paper Lion, George Plimpton is impressed with the intelligence level of pro football players. But Darwin is at work here.
November 19th, 2008 at 3:03 pmESTAside from the “BJ” comment, which he could have handled better, the administrator was right on in this case.
My dad would have told me the same thing. I can even imagine what he would tell me. He’d tell me to quit worrying about sports and work on bringing my grades up. In fact, when I was in junior high and high school, I was only allowed one extra-curricular activity per semester, and if my grades slipped (i.e. I started bringing home “C’s”) then I had to quit those activities until my grades improved.
November 19th, 2008 at 3:05 pmESTBravo to the school board member who gave a darn about this student!
Hopefully, though, they learned their lesson…NEVER PUT IT IN WRITING.
He should have made his response in person. I would have even approved of the term “blow jobs” having been used had it not been in writing. In fact, I think the school board should require that that letter be read as a commencement speech to every graduating class, hence forth.
I’m a Girl Scout leader and you all might be shocked and amazed the questions that come from some of my teenage girls. I always try to keep it on a professional level, but sometimes I dish with them. For instance I didn’t pull any punches when one of them mentioned how disappointed she was that she would have to wait until she was 18 to get a tattoo. I told them that when I was their age the only people who had tattoos were sailors and hookers. I let them draw their own conclusion from that statement as to which side of the fence I am on about getting a tattoo. Would I put that in writing? Not a chance.
Learned that lesson a long time ago when I put my disatisfaction in writing to a female supervisor. You know how us females are, we never forget, especially if there is a hard copy that we can use as proof.
I was going to end this by saying that the parents and commentors who had their panties all in a bunch were more than likely Obama supporters, but I think this crappy behavior of treating kids as though they are blameless gods is an equal opportunity destroyer to the upcoming generation of human beings that are going to be running(or should I say ruining?) our world.
November 19th, 2008 at 3:07 pmESTDon’t worry mare. I’m sure the rest of the school board will attack and smack this member down. And your world view can return to its normal balance.
November 19th, 2008 at 3:07 pmESTAs a parent, I agree 100% with that board member. Yes, the “blow job” comment may have been out of line - but otherwise he was doing that kid a service and was probably the only one who ever had the balls to do so. My town school department decided to stop having spelling bees because it “fostered an unnecessarily competitive atmosphere” (aka the speshul snowflakes got their feelings hurt) - and people wonder why my kid goes to private school.
I could barely read that kid’s email - it was so poorly written, and yes I will judge him. This is a kid who is touting himself as some kind of freaking genius for taking advanced math - yet he can barely string together a sentence. Guess what cupcake? I was the only freshman in Algebra II too - because I went to Catholic elementary school and my 8th grade math was what the public high school called “pre-algebra” It doesn’t make you Blaise Pascal.
November 19th, 2008 at 3:16 pmESTRachel - Heh heh, you said “sucks.”
But I have to know, is that literally or figuratively? Does your “friend” the football player suck in general as a human being or are you accusing him of offering blow jobs outside of a convenience store?
Like I said: NEVER PUT IT IN WRITING. Lest you be haunted all the days of your life by misconstruing crap bastards such as myself.
November 19th, 2008 at 3:21 pmESTCoulda been worse. Narcisse could have said ’suckin dick for Mad Dog money.’
November 19th, 2008 at 3:22 pmESTAfter thirteen years of school bus driving, I met my share of parents who actually had to be shown the three 6’s etched into their kids’ skulls to prove these little monsters were the Antichrist. They STILL refused to believe it. When we got cameras on the buses, I was present when a parent was shown her kid beatin the stuffing out of another kid on the bus. Her kid was full-frontal, no-mistake-about-it on the tape. Her response: That’s not my son.
So, will a lot of parents back every damned fool thing their kids do? Absolutely.
then you have moms like this.<~(That’s a link)
It occurs to me that this comment thread is going to yield some very interesting content-prompted ads.
November 19th, 2008 at 3:26 pmESTI work in a public high school. You have no idea the crap that goes on that parents and students think is perfectly all right for them to do. “Your snowflake hit another kid in the face.” “But he shouldn’t be suspended! That’s too severe!” Welcome to real life, kid…
November 19th, 2008 at 3:27 pmESTRather, I think his failure in Algebra II proves that his middle-school courses aren’t worth the high-school credits he “earned”. (I don’t care if the American way is to put the period inside the quotes; I’m doing it the right way.) Letting kids have advanced credit is foolhardy. There are gifted programs for those who are truly advanced. Bright kids should stick to the curriculum and knock it out of the park. Approaching high school I was placement-tested out of Algebra I, and I aced Geometery as a freshman. When it came time for sophomore math (at a different school) I looked at the textbook and realized I didn’t have the knowledge for Algebra II, so I went back and took Algebra I. I didn’t need anyone to tell me that I wasn’t ready.
November 19th, 2008 at 3:30 pmESTAs a former HS teacher and current parent, I think the school board member was spot on. The only reason he used “blow job” in the letter is because the dumb-shit student probably thinks “fellatio” is a type of Italian dessert.
I guess he would be correct in that assumption…in a way.
November 19th, 2008 at 3:32 pmESTand
then,
Mmmm…Jam and roll and fries. AND I’m pretty sure someone said something about a weiner somewhere.
Can you tell I’m on a diet? Didn’t even catch what these particular comments were about.
November 19th, 2008 at 3:38 pmESTLet’s be honest…Craig was probably receiving a dome polish from Randy the Git’N Go Wino when he received that email from Mr. Narcisse.
I kid, I kid.
I knew a lot of “student”-athletes, being one myself. I played three sports in HS, and played collegiate baseball. Most of them were entitlement brats, believing themselves to be athletes only. Being a 90-pound weakling who happened to be able to hit a baseball really well, I couldn’t afford to go easy on training. Due to this, and my own idiot slackerdom, my grades were never that important to me, but when I messed up, I blamed nobody but myself.
My father long ago told me that if I chose to be mediocre, he and my family would suffer in relative peace (albeit lovingly reminding me of the “blow jobs for crack” option), but if I chose mediocrity and then blamed someone else for it, my ass was his. Bad place to be. One time, I came home to find a Marine recruiter sharing sweet tea with the folks, waiting to inform me of the joys waiting for me at Paris Island. My old man does not f*** around.
Never in my life have I blamed someone else for my own failures, and I’ve been gainfully employed and needs-sufficient since I was 14. I’m not a great man, but I try every day now to be better than I was the day before. Young Craig needs to suck it up, and realize that half the school board likely thinks him a punk-ass crybaby, and the other half want to imprison Mr. Narcisse for his good advice. God, I hate kids and their dumbass enabling parents. I hope this precious snowflake learns that there’s more to life than effing Xbox and wrestling.
November 19th, 2008 at 3:41 pmESTCan you imagine the ad that will accompany this string of words? “’suckin dick for Mad Dog money.’”
Ewww. Just ewwww.
November 19th, 2008 at 3:45 pmESTFolks, Des Moines [and the Quad Cities] are what’s wrong with this state. No kidding. Honestly, the school board guy is an absolute moron for including that sexual comment. He completely undermined what was otherwise rock solid advice. These kids are such namby-pamby poofs, they would never have made it through school back in my day, when dinosaurs actually did roam the earth. They were called Buick Electras and, man, did they move. What are they going to do when they grow up? Oh, I forgot, we’re already being trained on how to communicate with Gen Y.
By the way, the end of the world is indeed nigh. Ford stock is at $1.27 with GM close behind at $2.65. Before everyone starts bashing Detroit again, do a search on the 1935 Wagner Act. Congress strikes again. That legislation basically gave the UAW monopoly rights on the U. S. auto manufacturers.
November 19th, 2008 at 3:50 pmESTThe ‘blow job’ reference was clearly a mistake–a political mistake. It forms the focus for the student or parent’s impotent irrational anger. The school board member should have known better, but I applaud him for responding; and responding with the appropriate message: ‘Life isn’t fair so STFU about it, and get to work.’
November 19th, 2008 at 3:52 pmESTI have a daughter in second grade who likes to play soccer. They have a spelling test in her class every Friday and they are responsible for learning the words (we were given a list of every week’s words at the beginning of the year). We told her that if she had not done the requisite spelling practices by soccer practice on Thursday, then she would get to stay home and do them. And, oh by the way, if she misses practice, then she does not get to play in the game on Saturday (our rule).
Miss two games due to lack of spelling homework? Glad you asked… she would owe us the $77 sign-up fee for the Y.
She has only missed one game and gotten perfect spelling scores ever since. So, yeah, I absolutely agree with the school board member.
November 19th, 2008 at 3:52 pmESTMAMT #6,
I, otoh, claim credit for being civil enough to not quite finish asking the question, being openminded enough to genericize gender out of the recipient.
Well, in that case, I’ll mention something found in a comment over @ Don Surber’s place. How about a bacon and apple pie? Just trying to be helpful.
November 19th, 2008 at 3:54 pmESTOne thing that sucks (no pun intended) about this is that people won’t be able to take a kid like me seriously, because the vast majority of kids my age are idiots. Sometimes I really hate my generation.
November 19th, 2008 at 3:56 pmESTI’m with David Krumm @ 2:21pm on this one.
The kid is trying to argue that he’s being incented to not take hard courses. He just doesn’t make the argument well. I also suspect the school board member understood this was his argument. For whatever reason he didn’t respond.
I see the kid’s point but I’m not particularly favored to agree with him. It seems more likely that he failed the course because of a choice he made that he needs to examine.
The parents? Meh. The BJ reference has the mother “mortified” and the father says, correctly, it was “inappropriate”. The mother says she wants to “express her concerns” to school officials. No lawyer or anything stupid as far as we know. As far as we know they are simply and honestly offended that a school board member said that to their son. They have that right.
Yes the kid probably hears this in the locker room, but also yes, it is reasonable for the parents to have an expectation that a communication with a school board member doesn’t occur on a high school locker room level.
And for what its worth, parenting is a helluva lot harder than it looks in this wretched society.
November 19th, 2008 at 3:56 pmESTThere was s study released recently that concluded that kids are grossly overconfident and have wildly unrealistic goals. They compared the responses of kids today to the responses on kids in the 70s to the same questions.
For instance, in the 70s, about 35% of kids thought they would be a good spouse or parent. Today, the numbers are over 50%. Also, kids believe that they are highly qualified for upper management positions immediately upon hiring.
Fox Business had a segment online about mistakes that kids newly into the corporate work force make and this was one of them. They don’t want to be the guy who gets the coffee; they expect to be in all the important meetings. In fact, they can’t understand why they aren’t a VP after six months.
The study pointed out that it’s the fault of parents and schools. Parents tell their kids that they are perfect at every turn and defend the kids vehemently whenever there are accusations made. Schools hand out “A’s” like candy and give awards to every kid for just showing up.
That’s why a kid wno’s probably not 16 yet thinks he is entitled to wrestle. It can’t be his fault he failed; it must be the rule.
November 19th, 2008 at 4:01 pmESTMethinks and hopes Sharon’s Daughter will have a chance to stand out in a crowd. You go, Girl! Go out into the world and find a job where you’re working for someone smarter than a sack of hammers, if you can.
November 19th, 2008 at 4:09 pmESTHi Carl! *waves*
November 19th, 2008 at 4:10 pmESTvette, ouch.
Ease up on us QC hicks. It was the best I could do to not end up on the IL side.
November 19th, 2008 at 4:14 pmESTThe school board member’s e-mail is the student/athlete equivalent of the Scared Straight intervention lectures where the juvenile delinquent budding “gangstas” are introduced to “Bubba” at the prison. The one where Bubba explains how he and his pals would jump over the cute girls in the audience to get to 15 year-old “DJ Jazzy Trevor” with his baggy pants and flat tummy. After a few minutes of Bubba’s attention, Trevor’s lip starts quivering and all that hard-on attitude goes by the wayside. But then Trevor’s mom probably wasn’t there haranguing the law enforcement folks for being too harsh.
As for failing the advanced math course, he either skated through the prerequisite courses and failed to learn the material or dogged it later. My guess, it’s a little of both — too much esteem building in middle school and too little work in the advanced course. No way you fail these days if you apply yourself.
November 19th, 2008 at 4:17 pmESTSio:
You’re essentially saying, the student knew the consequences when he made his decisions and he should now face them. That’s perfectly reasonable.
The school board member doesn’t make anything like that logical an argument. The school board member claims academic standards cannot be waved or the student will suffer later in life. But the student isn’t asking for academic standards to be waved, he acknowladges he failed the class and he intends to retake it. He wants athletic standards to be changed. I.E. he wants to participate in a sport even though he doesn’t meet all the eligibility requirements.
I’m not saying he should be allowed to do so. I’m saying neither of the two could argue their way out of a paper bag but the vague flailing of the student came closer to making a valid point. I’d require them both to join the debate team.
November 19th, 2008 at 4:20 pmESTOk, I’ll dissent, and I’m neither passive-aggressive nor non-confrontational.
Nearly every single one of you are complete and utter idiots. No, really. Even Rachel, for once. She’s going to pick nits about one poorly-written phrase?
And the rest of you are obviously listening to some shadow-play version of this kid in your head, instead of relating to the real world.
Review: a freshman took a junior-level math course. He flunked. He then sent a reasonably well-written letter (for a high school sophomore) maturely explaining why he thought he should not be benched, and if there were good reasons he should be penalized. Sorry, didn’t see any “whining” there.
A school board member then proceeded to completely ignore what the boy actually said, and responded to the fantasy in his head, not unlike most of the commenters on this thread. He lectures a boy who is taking two-years advanced math about the priority of academics. The board member then relates two completely irrelevant stories about two pampered athletes who later fared poorly in life, and tells his correspondent to “suck it up.” Obviously he thinks a polite, formal request for a review the act of a whiny loser.
Does he address the actual requirements of the school? No. Does he give evidence that the school’s position is the proper one? No, he talks about blow-jobs instead. That particular detail is a bit of a red herring, as it distracts from the fact that his letter was completely non-responsive to what the boy actually wrote. David Krumm is the only one I’ve seen here who has anything remotely resembling a clue on this very important point.
Note that all the dolts here went off on a tangent about lazy or uneducated kids who expected an easy ride in life, and so on. The only problem is that they literally have no idea of what this boy’s GPA is, work ethic, or anything else about him. No, they just jumped to several huge assumptions.
I take back part of one point; Miller at least raises the question of specific standards of eligibility. Alas, he also has no idea what the boy’s actual standing is, or how the failed class affected it. For example, did the mere existence of an “F” disqualify him? Does the school observe some sort of semester average, so that for any particular semester below a C (no matter the overall average) the student loses a semester (or quarter) of eligibility?
You. Don’t. Know.
That’s the problem here. TL mentions some slackers, but fails to explain how they relate to a young man who is obviously pushing himself to excel; quite the opposite. By the way, TL, your sentence should read “The sense of entitlement of some of the regular students displayed was appalling.” Pot, kettle, all that.
soulpile lives up to half of his nick, and piles on with yet another complaint about “ME” culture, again without managing to establish that this young man felt any kind of selfishness or entitlement.
physics geek pounds his virtual chest and lets loose with a torrent of electronic testosterone, and calls the boy an “academic deadbeat.” For protesting a disqualification over an advanced course which he was not obligated to take. Without the slightest evidence that Mr. Richman was not an otherwise highly motivated student.
gd later follows the crowd yakking on about “narcissistic entitlement.” Feh. The idiot comments are making me nauseous.
Get it through your thick skulls that Craig Richman did not whine, he politely inquired. He demonstrated no sense of any entitlement, nor did he demonstrate any sort of narcissism.
Now. For the three people out there who would like to address the real world, instead of the one inside their heads, try asking: exactly how did that failing grade disqualify him? It’s that simple. If -as Miller says- he dropped below a C GPA, then he is disqualified. But… Instead of this idiotic false machismo about “sucking it up,” why not explain (again, as Mr. Krumm pointed out) that those are the standards, that the board can’t or won’t make an exception as it would set a bad example, or would be legally unworkable, and explain why that is so? Is that so hard?
It might even be possible (God forbid!) that Mr. Richman has at least some basis for complaint. I guess I missed the local adult-studies class for clairvoyance and omniscience, since I’m nearly the only one here who doesn’t KNOW all about this young man.
If he is wrong, the adult approach would be to explain how his position is incorrect, why it is not feasible to grant his request, how to maintain his future eligibility (if there are requirements besides GPA), and how to avoid the situation in the future. For example, try 1-year advanced courses instead of 2-year.
As opposed to the “choke on this, ya little puke!!” approach…
November 19th, 2008 at 4:22 pmESTNo. Rachel, you are wrong. Narcisse was wrong, and it has nothing to do with his choice of language. All of you who are saying Narcisse (the Board member) was correct, that this is a good policy, and the like, are wrong.
Those of you who are parents and agree with the Board member are gravely mistaken as to what is in the best interests of your children as regards their education. I sincerely hope you will reconsider what you are saying, because if you treat your own children this way then you are failing as a parent.
You are all exactly what is wrong with high school education in the United States. No, it is not “government mismanagement”. Government mismanagement is a symptom. Your attitude is the problem.
Narcisse’s reply is exactly the sort of bullshit response you get when you treat a young person like a peg to be fit into a one-size-fits-all hole, label him with a number, e.g. GPA, and define “development” as a change in that number.
Based on the evidence we have, this kid is 1) smart (he’s in an advanced math class), 2) on a well-rounded path of development (he’s smart and he plays sports), 3) disciplined (high school wrestling is all about discipline), and 4) proactive.
Based on the evidence in the story to which Rachel linked, this is the kind of kid one hopes will get into West Point or Annapolis, or become a business manager, or some day hold political office.
Rachel, I have read your blog for a long time and I know that you are not the utter moron that you seem to be when you pick on the kid’s poor grammar and apostrophical oversight in an _email_. Now, my guess is that you are a bit younger than I, and perhaps you send or you have friends who send text messages which contain text such as “BRB” and “CU” and “luv u hun e”. Some of us who are just a bit older think this sort of slapdash phonetic abbreviation is an inane and distasteful bastardization of the English language. I, however, would never make the mistake of assuming that someone who texts “BRB” _does not know_ how to spell out “Please excuse me for a moment, I will be right back.” Rachel, to imply as you did that a forgotten apostrophe and slapdash grammar in an email prove that the kid is not smart, is just fucking stupid. That is why I am not going to claim that the misspellings in the reply letter illustrate the ignorance and stupidity of the Board member.
Personally, I feel that the content of the response is quite enough illustration.
The kid is in an advanced math class. Yes, the school placed him there. This is often called, well, placement. Not just anyone can volunteer for an advanced course. In a healthy learning environment those responsible for the structure ensure that students all have a certain basic level of knowledge and ability, such that the class is able to study advanced concepts without being held back by a single member who would be better off in a basic-level course. Staying in the advanced course, however, is completely optional. Anyone can drop out and join the basic class if the advanced work is too difficult. (How can you people not know this? Did you not have AP classes at your secondary schools?)
So this kid, as he explains, _chose_ to stay in an advanced class in which he was legitimately placed _by the school_ even though he found the material challenging. In other words HE’S NOT A QUITTER. Furthermore he remained committed to his wrestling team while gamely struggling to master the advanced mathematics. HE SHOWED CHARACTER, COMMITMENT, AND RESOLVE.
The advice this Board member gave to him was effectively “You should quit wrestling and focus on one thing at a time.”
Some of you may still be thinking, “Yes, that’s true. That’s good advice.”
Really? Is that the way you think a young man should be raised? “If you can’t handle it, quit?” When he is an adult and he is struggling to hold together a marriage and do well at his job, should he decide that he is going to quit one of them and focus on one thing at a time?
Or should he do what this kid wants to do: buckle down, give his best, and try again and harder if his best comes short.
Yes we have rules regarding academic achievement for _college_ athletes. The purpose of these rules is to prevent unsportsmanlike behavior _by the coaches and schools_.
High school sports are not a “privilege”. High school sports are part of a balanced and well-rounded education. The field and the court and the mat and the track are places where young people learn things like teamwork, and commitment, and perseverance, and magnanimity, and resilience, and leadership. Virtually every respected educational program throughout history has included sport as an aspect of that education.
I am going to see if I can find Craig Richman’s email address, and if I can I am going to write him and offer to consider writing him a recommendation to my alma mater, which while it has many faults is consistently ranked amongst the top liberal arts colleges in the country. If any of you know him, please let him know that he can email me at dirtyrottenvarmint@yahoo.com, after which I’ll give him my real name and contact info if he is interested.
November 19th, 2008 at 4:35 pmESTCASEY AND DIRTYROTTENVARMINT:
Normally, I would delete and/or edit such unnecessarily long comments that also contained name-calling and insults directed toward me and my regulars. I’m tempted to ask you try to again, this time much more succinctly and without calling anyone here “idiots” or “dolts” or “morons”.
But I won’t, because maybe some of the people you just freaked out on would like to address you directly.
Just consider this your warning. I don’t like comments that long unless they’re full of valuable information, not a rant, or unless you’re someone I know personally and/or trust because of past performance.
And that is the last time you get to call me an idiot on my own blog. Go to your blog and do that. I won’t mind. You won’t be the first.
Mostly, you need to cool out.
Also, Varmint, you might be full of shit. If you’ve been reading my blog for a “long time” as you say, you’d have caught the several references to my actual age (36), and would not have to assume or wonder if I’m younger than you.
Seriously. Why can’t you disagree and make your points without calling me or anyone else “idiots” or “morons”? I didn’t call the kid any rude names, in case you didn’t notice. YOU TWO ARE EXACTLY WHY I HATE BLOGGING SOMETIMES. Goddamn. State your case without being so snippy and insulting, or do those things all you want ON YOUR OWN BLOGS. And good grief, cut down on the length. I’m paying for this bandwidth, you know.
Oh and one last thing, Varmint? It’s not very smart to write your email address like that. Bots, and all. You’ll probably get spammed now and it won’t be my fault. That’s why I don’t show anyone’s address in comments, trying to protect them and all. You kinda shot yourself in the foot there, but I’ll edit it if you want. Just because I’m not the “utter moron” that I seem to be.
November 19th, 2008 at 4:35 pmESTCasey:
You’re wrong. Let me explain:
Let’s translate that statement properly: the student in question took and passed Algebra and Geometry, the two prerequisites for Algebra II, and then proceeded to flunk Algebra II.
So a student does not fit into the lowest common denominator, but rather proceeds at a pace with which he is comfortable. This is admirable. I also was taking advanced classes throughout high school. However, once you’ve passed a class, it’s time to move on to the next class. You are not allowed to take algebra again after getting through geometry successfully. You move on to algebra II. If you fail, you don’t get kudos for attempting a class “beyond your years”. You rightfully get looked at scornfully for slacking off. There’s no question that the kid in question is bright: he had passed algebra and geometry before most of his classmates had. That part is admirable. What is not admirable is him failing to put in the effort required at the next level.
Umm, this presupposes that the teen in question was unaware of the academic requirements for eligibility. Since even the actual dumb jocks in my high school knew what they had to do, and this kid is not a dummy, I’d say that that position is disingenuous. The student knew what he had to do, but he failed to do it. Rather than buckle down for 6 weeks to try and pull his grades up, he COMPLAINED to someone that the requirements were unfair. Changing the rules after you’ve played the game is not allowed, and whining like a little child when you screwed the pooch by, and I’ll admit to guessing a bit here, being lazy and failing to do your work.
One other thing about high school athletes: many of them are, or at least used to be, coddled by the schools. They are allowed to turn in late work, substandard work, or sometimes no work at all, yet many of them somehow manage to stay eligible. I’ll give you one personal example:
An old girlfriend of mine in college confessed to me that she had graduated high school without being able to read. When I inquired how that was possible, she replied, “I was a swimmer; they let me through.”
What she did next was learn to read WHILE attending community college, having her roommate read her lessons to her during the 1-1/2 hour drive to and from school. She managed to learn to read and did pretty well in college, becoming a physical therapist. I told her not to be embarrassed, but rather proud of how she had overcome. Sure, she bears a great deal of responsibility for not bothering to learn to read, but the school administrators should be flogged for (a) not noticing or (b) not caring.
There’s a reason that the word “student” comes first in the term student-athlete. This lazy teenage is being taught that lesson; it’s a good one that he will hopefully take to heart. And the school board member should be commended for holding the kid accountable.
As for the “choke on it, ya little puke” tone of the reply, I would have been fine with “Tough shit. Grow up.” But the administrator’s words were fine.
November 19th, 2008 at 4:48 pmESTCasey = Dirtyrottenvarmint?
I mean, what are the odds?
November 19th, 2008 at 4:48 pmESTIt is a strange world were a freshman is taking the second semester class of high school Algebra and is considered to be taking ‘advanced’ classes. So what if it isn’t required until your junior year. If he had been taking calculus I would have more sympathy. (It wasn’t that many years ago, that algebra was considered a freshman class offering.)
November 19th, 2008 at 4:50 pmESTRachel says:
Uh, sorry if my post was excessively long, blogmistress. I sometimes wax too long when riled up. This is your sandbox. I’ll attempt to play by the rules.
November 19th, 2008 at 4:51 pmEST[Geek! Don't be a 'tard. Note the part where I said: "...unless you’re someone I know personally and/or trust because of past performance." That would be commenters like YOU. Also, feel free to wax on as long as you like when you're responding to someone who just called me and half my regulars an idiot or a moron. Seriously. Have at it. In fact I'll be pissed if you don't. - Rachel]
Maya-
“How the fuck is some guy on the school board a role model?”
You went to school when not everybody worked for the government. Now, you can start on the school board (or the Annenberg Challenge, same deal) and become president.
Re the BJ: what would have koshered it? “oral sex”? “Sexual services?” Would it have been more appropriate to say “dealing drugs?”Fact: WHORING is one of the more attractive career tracks when you have no other skills. Maybe he should have skipped the Technicolor and said “punch-press operator”or “McDonalds drone”, but the verbal slap-inna-face was definitely called for.
November 19th, 2008 at 4:52 pmESTPersonally I agree with you Rachel. More kids need tough love today and sadly are not getting it. Each generation is becoming more spoiled than the last. Life isn’t fair. There are consequences and risks like you said. There is something called hard work. There are such things as winning AND losing. I remember reading some article a few years ago about how some schools were eliminating the “red checkmarks” for wrong answers because they were all about not getting down on the child’s self esteem. Give me a freaking break. The more we raise spoiled rotten children, the more spoiled rotten adults we have to deal with. Take a look around in your work place. Know any?
November 19th, 2008 at 4:53 pmESTPhysics:
Are you sure about the information?
Or is the class in question, Algebra (’2′ as in second semester). If it is required to be completed by a junior year, it would make more sense that it was Algebra I second semester.
November 19th, 2008 at 4:55 pmESTRachel - this statement below says that this person hasn’t read your blog…EVER.
Condescending asshat. How dare you.
Good Lord, if I thought Rachel ever used the phrase “luv u hun e” in text message or otherwise, I would have quit reading her blog a long time ago.
Idiots, morons, and dolts…oh my! I prefer Bible-gun clinging warmongler, thank you very much.
There’s a beautifully illustrated children’s book that reminds me of this very situation. It’s called:
“The Trouble with Trolls.”
November 19th, 2008 at 4:58 pmESTHEY! Wait, wait, wait, please? Wasn’t it our dear President Clinton, that made “blow-jobs” “acceptable”? The moral and natural norm? What “is” is, an alla that?
Please, this kiddo is a whiney kiddo, just like his folks brought him up to be. That’s all there is to it. Had he the conviction of his thought and beliefs to go before the board and speak his piece, I would have had more respect for his point. But that board member layed it out straight for the whiner and now his parents are trying to turn it out to be something totally different than what it was. The friggen truth!!
A little cheeze with that whine, Craigster?
Good grief.
November 19th, 2008 at 4:59 pmESTphysics geek said “blogmistress”…again.
It’s…it’s just so dirty sounding.
God, I love this blog.
November 19th, 2008 at 5:02 pmESTHaverwilde Says:
That is a completely valid question. I tend to use my high school filter on required classes. It’s entirely possible that I misread it and it was the second semester of Algebra I. If so, I’m cutting the kid even less slack than I did before, which, in truth, wasn’t any.
I just looked at the article again and he student in question wrote this:
One final thought: outside of orchestra, I took only AP classes my senior year. If I had failed any of those, no one would have patted me on the back and said “but you tried harder than some”. I took the next classes in the sequence of what I had already taken.
November 19th, 2008 at 5:02 pmESTWould it surprise you to know that that thought had not actually occurred to me until this very instant? It kind of surprised me, especially since I have to pull my mind UP into the gutter. And now I’m remembering Wizard’s First Rule and thoughts of Mord-Sith Blogmistress Deanna, uhh, Rachel, are circulating through my brain.
I’m a bad, bad man.
November 19th, 2008 at 5:05 pmESTNarcisse isn’t guilty of being “politically incorrect” for the blow job remark, he’s guilty of extremely poor judgment.
That he showed poor judgment there might make the kid wonder how much attention he should pay to the rest of what the man had to say.
That effect is multiplied by the board member not addressing the arguments the boy made. It’s really quite to the boy’s credit that he had the initiative to email. He didn’t ask his parents to fix it for him, he tried to do it himself.
Or maybe Mom and Dad had already told him, “No, we’re not helping you out of this. We didn’t get you into it.”
The board member’s letter talked down to the kid and let him know his arguments weren’t worth consideration when he could have explained why they should not be considered.
The only thing the school board member got right was having good intentions.
November 19th, 2008 at 5:08 pmESTHaverwilde, DMPS high school students are required to complete Integrated Algebra I (1 year) and Integrated Geometery (1 year) prior to taking Integrated Algebra II.
November 19th, 2008 at 5:08 pmESTPoor Casey/Dirtyrottenvarmint…
I hope the view from that cross is worth the ridicule you’ve heaped upon yourself. I will politely disagree, and second Haverwilde’s comment. Algebra II is not, repeat NOT, advanced. It might be for an academically inferior student, but he clearly is not that. He took the initiative to present his case before the school board (albeit via email, which is a poor medium), and gave a somewhat cogent case for his reinstatement.
However, you are setting up a strawman by claming that we don’t know the situation, and are therefore incorrect to criticize. This is not an isolated incident to anyone who has attended a high school. Rachel was making a larger point by using this case as an illustration of how our disintegrating school system and enabling parents are destroying their kids’ initiative and leaving them ill-equipped to deal with the realities of life.
If I take more on my plate than I can handle at work, and I get reprimanded, I don’t get to cry that I should get points for trying. THAT is the reality of Craig’s future. Unless he becomes YOUR employee (since you are such a kind, understanding soul) or a politician, he will be accountable to people who will not brook excuses and failure to perform. He will be culled from the herd, and no amount of mommy-whining will save his ass. Don’t wade into the water and call us (and Rachel) a bunch of reactionary dolts. This is the dining room of rational, experienced adults, and you are trying to sit at our table. Go sit at the kids’ table until you learn your manners.
November 19th, 2008 at 5:10 pmESTExactly my thoughts.
November 19th, 2008 at 5:11 pmESTGod love you, PG, that is an awesome reference. Stand up and take a bow. Goodkind can paint a scene can’t he? I’m disappointed the series is over, and damnitall, the show isn’t that good. I expected better, considering Sam Raimi’s involvement and the incredible source material. FWIW, my wife wants an Agiel for Christmas. Apparently, I’m poorly disciplined. Like Craig Richman…aaaaaaaaand we’ve come full circle.
November 19th, 2008 at 5:16 pmESTDr. FG - Hellooooo over there. I’m in the remaining red third [quarter] of the state. Just so you voted correctly, you’re in the clear.
November 19th, 2008 at 5:18 pmESTFlyover Country Says:
I should have known the readers here would get it. Just wait until I start referring to unknown and more esoteric works of fantasy and scifi. We’ll just see how strong the geekfu is in everyone.
And no, the series isn’t great, but I’m still enjoying it.
Hey, I just started a new topic! Let’s- what’s that up in the sky?
It’s a bird!
It’s a plane!
It’s… oh crap, it’s the BanHammer. ::thud::
November 19th, 2008 at 5:21 pmESTYes, yes you are.
(But I loved the reference.)
November 19th, 2008 at 5:24 pmESTMAMT#6,
Ummmmmm…you said “hooker” and lumped them right in there with “sailors”! Ummmmmmmm…i’m tellin’ mamma on you…shame shame shame!
November 19th, 2008 at 5:29 pmESTIn light of those who disagreed, I went back and reread Craig’s letter. I still think it sounds whiny. Particularly this part of the 4th paragraph.
He argues that he took an advanced class and stretched himself, and therefore he should not be punished for failure. Otherwise he should understand the school doesn’t want students to challenge themselves. I can’t help but think that’s a crap argument, largely because I don’t view the class as “advanced”. If he was talking about calculus, that would be different, but algebra II is expected of everyone.
Excuse me, I just saw a rat in my back yard. Must deal with it.
November 19th, 2008 at 5:41 pmESTThanks for the opportunity, Rachel, but I’ll pass. I try not to answer trollish comments because it’s a waste of my time. If these commenters wanted to debate, they would. What they really want to do is abuse others while hiding anonymously behind their keyboards.
November 19th, 2008 at 5:44 pmESTOne of my favorite fantasies involves me catching up to whoever infected our culture with the ridiculous idea that teenagers are “sweet widdow chiwwdwen” who should be sheltered at all costs from the evil, rough, adult realities of the world. Both the schools that encourage a sense of utter entitlement in “star athletes” (and create monsters thereby) and parents who persist in thinking their kid’s some sort of sheltered Victorian innocent have a lot to answer for.
November 19th, 2008 at 5:44 pmESTCheck that. I lost every single ballot position, including the retention vote on an uber-lame associate county judge. I think I need a new job in red territory.
November 19th, 2008 at 5:46 pmESTI’m with the school board guy as well. I used to teach in the public education system. Lucky for me I taught in a small enough school system where most of the time you could be straight up and no bullshit with your kids. With parents like that I’m amazed that people can even wonder why we have precious little snoflakes. Sheesh.
November 19th, 2008 at 5:59 pmESTExactly what are you visualizing? Thigh-high boots, black leather corset, naughty bits hanging out, whip? Fie! A one-time co-worker who took care of our site giggled when I called her “webmistress.” She thought it was cute.
The headache with the Narcisse letter was injecting blowjobs into the context distracted too many people (incl moi). Pragmatically I’ll hazard these points:
1.) This was a fart in a teapot until the parents overreacted.
2.) Narcisse will probably end up being kicked off the board for committing the crime of honesty.
3.) The kid will soon regret this, if he doesn’t already realize he’s become a self-made fool.
pfaah. The period goes outside the paren but inside the quote mark? That’s too illogical for me.
November 19th, 2008 at 6:00 pmESTCasey and Dirtyrottenvarmint,
Please don’t have kids. There are plenty of self-entitled, arrogant little slackers with enabling parents running around already.
The kid whines that if he doesn’t get special treatment after failing a class (not that smart or disciplined apparently) he’s going to lose all faith in the educational system and insinuates that it could only be because the board member doesn’t care about educating kids.
He was placed in a class a year early because he had already performed the pre-requisites. He failed knowing the consequences, but feeling they shouldn’t apply to him because he’s special and perfect in every way and it was in no way his fault for failing to study.
The board member was spot on. If anything, he wasn’t harsh enough considering the tone the little brat took in his letter. The BJ reference was obviously unprofessional, but forgiveable.
November 19th, 2008 at 6:07 pmESTHigh school coaches tell you to “suck it up” when it comes to complaining about working out too hard or something sore and aching or . . . something. So, if you want to play, suck it up and play! But, that was NEVER put in writing!
Army sergeants in boot camp referred to “blow jobs” and other such things. But, what were we doing in the Army? Well, as the base commander said, “you’re here to train to KILL people!” Once again, NEVER put in writing.
So, both examples are great for their applications and the people saying them. For a member of the school board? Prim and proper etiquette. No references to BJs or going down on someone or not acting like a pu. . . . well, YOU know! And, DEFINITELY don’t put it in writing!
As for sex ed class? Why is ANYthing other than how a boy gets a girl pregnant being taught? Only how to reproduce is necessary, and why it is best to wait until after graduation and when a person is older and more responsible.
You want the students to know how to analkiss, buttlick, BenDover, clitpick, etc.? Go to a bookstore and find a book that suits such subjects. THAT can be taught in the home.
November 19th, 2008 at 6:15 pmESTDamnation. It got away.
Anyway, what I was about to say before I got distracted by the rat…
The email was a poor (IMO) excuse for asking for special treatment. It sounded very much to me like “If you don’t do as I say, I won’t like you anymore.” I had a friend like that once. In preschool.
This quote from the article was what makes me think the kid is a whiner, rather than making a proactive attempt at changing a policy:
There is a difference between a school board member and a school counselor.
I was in the advanced classes. I took Alg II. If this guy took Alg I and geometry in middle school, then he is, at the very least, decent at math. If a person is decent at math, pays attention in class, and does his homework, then Alg II should NOT BE THAT HARD to pass!
This young man reminds me very much of a few kids I went to high school with. Perhaps that colors my perception and makes me inclined to have little sympathy. Maybe there are more details to the issue than we know, and maybe the email isn’t a good display of what this kid is like. That is certainly possible. But it’s no reason to call me an idiot.
I will agree, however, that those who argue that Narcisse ignored the kid’s arguments have a point. He did. Probably because he thought they were too crummy to bother with. His reply would have been better and more complete had it included an address of the argument about challenging classes. Such as, if Iowa does it like they did in my own school district, kids who took honors classes got a cushion of 3-5 (I forget precisely how much) points on their grading period grade because of the added difficulty of the class. Which is how the 67 I got one grading period in honors physics did not make me ineligible. (That and it later turned out my teacher screwed up and calculated my grade wrong.)
I can’t help but think that failing the entire second semester indicates a long term problem that should have been looked at long before one week prior to wrestling season.
Sorry for the lengthiness…
November 19th, 2008 at 6:29 pmESTI know that in California, when I went to HS, (and according to my 15 year old sister, it hasn’t changed) Algebra I was usually taken as a freshman, Geometry as a Sophomore, and Algebra II as a Junior. However, a good number of kids in my junior high started Algebra in 8th grade. I think I heard on the news a while back that California wants to make Algebra I a requirement for all middle school children, so that when they hit high school, they start with Geometry and then go on to Algebra II as a sophomore. Algebra II is not considered an AP class as far as I’ve always known.
November 19th, 2008 at 6:35 pmESTWow. That turned ugly. Yay Trolls.
I agree with MAMT#6, I’m willing to bet that if Rachl Lukis posted the IP’s of Casey/DRV, they would be the same. Or maybe off by one. Two long screeds saying the same thing (? didn’t read the second one) right after one another is too much of a coinicidence.
And I really don’t think we should be calling it an advanced class. Just cuz you take it early doesn’t mean it’s advanced.
November 19th, 2008 at 6:35 pmESTTinyTinaTunaFish that’s the way it is now; my freshman son is taking Geometry, so if whiner-boy here were in California, he’d be taking a class ONE year ahead of where he was (were?) supposed to be.
And I’m calling bullshit all around on his excuse… he knew the consequences of failure, because not a practice went by for my son’s football team where his coach didn’t remind them that no grades = no football. And yes; wrestling =/= football, California =/= whereverthefuck USA, but he knew, and was trying to weasel out of it.
I do wish the admin hadn’t used the blowjob reference, as unfortunately that gives contrarians something to hang their excuses on. But that’s a minor quibble; hopefully he’ll get it right the next time.
November 19th, 2008 at 6:48 pmESTI did Algrebra I as Freshman because I was accelerated, Algebra II as a Sophomore, Trig/Advanced Math as a Junior. I took Geometry in Summer School so I could take a 1 1/2 session Calculus class Senior year. Most kids got thru Algebra II by graduation.
Look, the fact is that schools are for education. Sports are secondary. However, the School official who wrote that note is just an asshole, and should be sanctioned if not removed from the board. I can cite many examples of A students who completely fucked up their adult lives, and/or failed miserably in college. Hell, why not tell the kid you get a tutor, or keep up your scores via periodic exam and consult with the teacher, or you sit out from Rasslin’? Why the zero/one approach?
November 19th, 2008 at 6:50 pmESTMe thinks you might be projecting.
You might have handled it differently. Narcisse didn’t. His statement does not invalidate what he was trying to get through this teenagers thick skull. And it does not invalidate that a lesson learn hard, is a good lesson indeed.
November 19th, 2008 at 7:02 pmESTI’m torn here. I do like the general message from Narcisse, but I don’t think the kid deserves quite the pile on he’s getting here. He got a little whiny in his email, no doubt. And the family loses massive points for running to the media with this. But I give him some credit for at least pushing himself a bit in school and being proactive enough to try to rectify a problem on his own.
I have a hard time faulting anyone for failing algebra these days. I recently tutored Algebra and Algebra 2 students online for about a year. I bought myself a current textbook so I would have a frame of reference. Between looking at that and talking to the kids, I was flabbergasted at what currently passes for algebra teaching. The focus is entirely on word problems to keep things interesting, at the expense of basic algebraic concepts. The number of kids who effusively thanked me for teaching them ridiculously important things like the FOIL method and simple exponential rules makes me want to slit an artery or two. Believe me when I say that you do not have to be an idiot to have a hard time grasping algebra in 2008.
Edited to add that while a smart kid can fumble through Algebra I without ever really getting the basic framework, it gets a lot harder in Algebra II. It’s entirely possible that he didn’t sit the semester out with his thumb up his ass. Honestly, for kids in the programs I was dealing with, I don’t know how any of them pass without a parent or tutor who can fill in the gaps for them.
November 19th, 2008 at 7:51 pmESTHaverwilde:
I think Algebra II is just a not-so-fancy way of saying Trigonometry.
In my past experience the eligibility clause only came into effect if the athlete wasn’t that good. I specifically remember one guy I ran track with, who had terrible grades and was suspended a lot, was on the team every year. The guy was a pretty good distance runner, probably now working at McDonald’s or something.
November 19th, 2008 at 8:12 pmESTIs everyone here a total amnesiac?
Or is everyone posting here too young to remember the origins of the phrase “suck it up?” It has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with things sexual. Rather it means “suck up your GUTS”, i.e., “gird your loins” for the upcoming battle, struggle, etc. As in, one must “soldier on”, despite the odds, etc. (It is generally thought that it originated from the physical act of taking a deep breath that many athletes do prior
to the physical act itself in which case the diaphragm is raised along with the intestines.)
I am totally amazed at the ignorance shown here regarding the derivation of this phrase…..
November 19th, 2008 at 8:19 pmEST[Um Virgil? I don't think you're paying very close attention. There's no confusion here about the phrases in question. The school board guy's reference to oral sex has absolutely no connection to his separate invitation to "suck it up", and everyone here is quite clear on that. Except maybe you? Trying to be nice, but you're the one saying everyone else is ignorant. - Rachel]
WAIT A FRAKKIN’ MINUTE!!!
Do you mean that I have another alter-ego who is NOT a counselor aboard the Enterprise?? Will my husband be happy about this one?
November 19th, 2008 at 8:26 pmESTWho is saying “suck it up” is sexual? It’s the reference to blow jobs.
November 19th, 2008 at 8:31 pmESTI don’t think those that know the phrase “suck it up”, doesn’t know where it came from. The sexual context came from the parents making an issue of the words “blow job”.
November 19th, 2008 at 8:45 pmESTJW, what might I be projecting? I was responding to a comment (way above, as I got interrupted while writing my comment) that the “blow job” remark was merely politically incorrect.
The kid might have handled it differently too. He didn’t. That doesn’t invalidate his attempt to properly use the system to address his grievance, however unimportant that grievance is in the long run of his life.
I also think all the comments nitpicking about the difference between an advanced class and a class advanced for a particular grade level are a bit silly too. It’s irrelevant. If he was taking AP Calculus as a freshman and failed, he still shouldn’t be allowed in sports, if that’s what the rules are.
November 19th, 2008 at 8:46 pmESTYou pegged me on that one Glenn, I am a very visual person. But, as much as I adore Rachel, that wasn’t my vision at all. Think more along the lines of physics geek (who apparently didn’t even think what he said at all naughty) groveling at our dear Rachel’s feet. My image never went higher than her ankle.
Sounds like your imaginings of Rachel are well at the ready and burned in your mind’s eye. Heh heh.
BTW - in response to an old comment, I’m hoping we end up in Chula Vista or Bonita. Worse comes to worse, Temecula. I’m really hoping we can be closer to the beach. That way when the inevitable nuclear blast that is coming to wipe out San Diego (according to my husband, Paranoid AM Radio Listener) we will be sure to be evaporated with the first blast, rather than be left to wander as glowing eyed zombies like the in-landers. (Is it any wonder I haven’t had a decent night of sleep since the election?)
One last thing, I did Black’s beach back in 1984. Loved your story. My only complaint was that I was sunburned in places I hadn’t expected and that climb back up the cliff was horrific.
November 19th, 2008 at 9:01 pmESTNo, virgil, we’re not ignorant, but we can read… suck it up and give it a try. Sound out the big words if you have to; I won’t even be able to see your lips moving from here.
November 19th, 2008 at 9:39 pmESTMemo to asshole:
I hate you.
Whiny little pissants like you make my job ten times harder than it needs to be.
November 19th, 2008 at 9:40 pmESTI do. Too many whiners like him have been allowed to wallow in mediocrity and failure because no one had the cajones to look them in the eye and tell them to “suck it up”.
November 19th, 2008 at 9:48 pmESTI suppose the BJ reference was inappropriate. Here’s something my father used to tell his junior high school students: “Everyone grab your left ear with your right hand. Okay, now everybody give your ears a good hard tug and pull your heads from your asses and pay attention!” He was a very popular teacher. Of course, that was back in the day when all the teachers smoked in the teachers’ lounge — whenever the door to that room opened a brown cloud of tobacco fumes would roll out. And when I was a kid going to school (not the same school — we lived in a different district from where my father worked) it was assumed I’d pass my classes and if I didn’t it was my own fault, and if I got in trouble at school the default position was in favor of the school unless I could prove otherwise. Anyway, no one those days complained to their mommies and daddies about unfair treatment from the teachers unless they wanted to be labeled rich wussy babies. Of course, there were a few of those, but everyone hated them.
November 19th, 2008 at 10:05 pmESTThis looks like a tempest in a teapot to me. The kid is a sophomore. I dunno about the rest of you folks, but I was a d*ckhead when I was a high school sophomore, and so were most of the other kids I knew. It’s wrong, but it’s natural.
Judging by the grammar of the student’s letter, he wrote it himself (that’s fine) or his parents shouldn’t be voting or displaying high school diplomas (I hope that’s not the case). I’m a bit surprised that he sent this letter to the school board — I would have started with a teacher — but perhaps his parents or a teacher or a coach advised him too. I can just see a coach saying “take it up with the school board; that’s the policy.”
The teacher’s response looks fine to me. He’s drilling some sense into the kid, which is a teacher’s job. If the kid was genuine in the letter, then I hope he takes the response to heart and improves his character from sophomore to junior.
November 19th, 2008 at 10:12 pmESTSo he should consider the kid’s argument in order to illustrate why it shouldn’t be considered? What kind of logic is that?
Bottom line: The little whiner knew EXACTLY what he was getting into when he signed up for an “advanced” course. He KNEW taking this class meant a heavier work load. He KNEW that if he failed he would have to sit out the wrestling season.
A SMART student would have taken this as a message to put in some extra study hours, take extra-detailed notes, maybe talk to someone who can tutor him if he’s struggling. But he did none of that. And now he’s all upset because he has to suffer the consequences of his bad judgment.
You want sensitivity, talk to a guidance counselor.
November 19th, 2008 at 10:19 pmESTDeanna,
I should have said Mord-Sith Mistress Denna. My bad. Then again, maybe your hubby wouldn’t mind you in skin tight red leather.
Rachel, you are asking quite a lot of me. You do actually read my comments, right?
November 19th, 2008 at 10:37 pmESTmightysamurai - you don’t think there’s a difference in explaining why the argument won’t work and in ignoring it altogether?
Encouragement doesn’t always take the form of “you’re great kid!” Sometimes it takes the form of “you can do better and these are the reasons I know you can.”
Of course kids are whiny and that’s why you take every opportunity to show them that whining doesn’t work. By the time they are 14 or 15, you should be able to explain to them why their reasoning doesn’t work. Why ignore it?
I applaud my daughter every day because she’s teaching my almost 2 year old granddaughter what is OK to do and what is not. She’s doing it with age appropriate techniques — time outs for some things, ignoring her for others (ie, whining or crying when put to bed), and instant removal in case of a public infraction (ie, throwing books at the library).
What the school board member wrote was age inappropriate in both the use of language and in ignoring the boy’s arguments.
November 19th, 2008 at 10:39 pmESTI can guarantee all of you that I am not Casey and Casey is not me.
Rachel, I would probably continue to read your blog even if you banned comments. Or if you banned me from commenting. Do you only want comments that flatter you and agree with your viewpoint? I had presumed that the purpose of a comments section was to invite discussion.
I did not realize that you pay for the extra bandwidth. Of course this is entirely your decision, but thank you very much. On the other hand, it’s pretty immature to lambast your critics for taking the time and effort to explain why we think you are wrong, yet stay silent regarding the many posts herein which frivolously discuss the origins of the term “suck it up” and the like. Perhaps I missed the reference to your age. Or perhaps, while I appreciate your sharing these thoughts on your blog, your personal situation is just not all that important to me.
To those in these comments who responded with insults and accusations of “troll!” to me and to Casey without even attempting to refute our respective arguments…hi there. Any time.
To those who did attempt a refutation, good for you. I mean that, thank you for the honest attempt to defend your viewpoint.
You are still wrong. High school is not a “job”. High school is one part of the holistic organized method by which we hope to develop responsible and productive adults. Failing in a class at school and failing on the job are two entirely different things. Failure in class is part of the accepted learning process. This is why students do not perform heart surgery. This is why we grade students, instead of firing them. That said, if everyone shared your attitudes regarding “on-the-job” failure, nobody would ever have invented anything.
Those of you who are parents and who have said that you support Narcisse’s advice and that you tell your own children that academic achievement is more important than sports: that’s your prerogative as a parent. I happen to agree with you. Quite strongly. However, let me ask you, hypothetically: if the reply to Richman’s email had been “Suck it up kid, stop wasting your time in a math class you failed, and in the future focus on wrestling” - what would your response have been?
It’s not up to the School Board or any Board member to decide what is best for the healthy development of Craig Richman. It’s not up to you, and it’s not up to the parents of any other child. It’s up to Craig’s parents or his legal guardians, and as he grows into manhood it is increasingly up to Craig. And that’s why you are all what is wrong with our educational system. The most distasteful aspect of this entire goings-on is that Richman had to write a letter to the Board begging to be allowed to pursue his own personal development. The most heartening aspect is that he sucked up the guts to do so.
If you don’t like this - if you think that it shouldn’t be up to the Richmans to determine what is in Craig Richmans best interest, and yes even if that means they don’t agree with your precious ideas of what is best - I invite those of you who live in the U.S. to move to some other country that does not share our value of individual rights and responsibility. Perhaps China, where your children can be told whether or not they may attend a university and what course of study they will pick, based on a government-administered exam.
November 19th, 2008 at 11:13 pmESTThe school board reply was *way* too long.
“You apparently met the requirements to take your math class at the time. You chose not to devote the effort and attention many of your classmates did. You failed. You cost the school system the value of providing that seat in that classroom - we won’t be rewarding you for taking the teacher’s time, for consuming resources - and wasting it all.
No one enjoys being told “you lost out.” You have the advantage, in this case, of understanding that your suspension from sports is due to your own choice and decision, rather than the random circumstances that interfere with other people’s dreams.
Your value to this school, to your fellow students, and to your community, is in the lessons you learn. Flunking math and shrugging off the consequences is *not* a lesson that will benefit you or our community.”
November 19th, 2008 at 11:18 pmESTOf course there’s a difference. But that isn’t what the school board member did, now is it?
The whiner was trying to get a member of the school board to make it so he wouldn’t have to suffer the consequences of his failure. The school board member told him that, sorry, but your actions have consequences just like everybody else’s.
Just because you don’t like his answer doesn’t mean he ignored the little whiner’s argument.
Again, if you want sensitivity and encouragement, go talk to a guidance counselor. This guy was a member of the school board, not a therapist, and not a den mother. It’s not his responsibility to give “encouragement”.
November 20th, 2008 at 12:01 amESTI’m sorry, but are you actually being serious here? You really don’t see a difference between telling a kid to focus on academics, and telling a kid to forget academics and focus on sports?
…Are you on drugs?
No, the most distasteful aspect of this entire goings-on is that you think having to sit out on wrestling for a season is somehow preventing this whiner from “pursuing his own personal development”.
You say we are all what is wrong with our educational system. I say YOU are what is wrong with our educational system. You actually think allowing students to “pursue their own personal development” is more important than learning.
You obviously haven’t the slightest clue what you’re talking about.
November 20th, 2008 at 12:16 amEST[snark]
I was projecting your imaginings of Rachel. Mine didn’t appear until you brought it up. Are you accusing geek of being a footie or something?
Eeew. If y’all work in the City, Temecula puts you going south @ 0mph on I-15 mornings and north @ 0mph afternoons. I’m pleased in my 30 years here I always had, if any, an E-W commute. Shift-tweaking helps little. If you leave work @ 3PM, you run into the 3PM rush of people who left early to avoid the 4PM and 5PM rushes. There’s also the 11AM rush caused by the early-lunch crowd.
Rats. I guess, then, my proposal (proposition?) would be out of order. I was really taking a shine, too. But no ill meant. He can start with KCBQ. Talk radio has way more commercials than I can stand. I prefer classical in car but SD is too declasse to even have a classical station. About the only one can be heard inland is 104.9 in Tijuana.
What places didn’t you expect?? A really good brass band used to give Sunday nite free concerts in the Oceanside bandshell, right down on the beach. Once we miscalculated and Joyce was looking for as close to naked as she could get away with in public, settled on naked under sundress, went to the concert, froze her little (sunburned) fanny off.
November 20th, 2008 at 1:43 amEST[/snark]
Just being helpful.
Narcisse is attempting to go against the liberal old boy’s network to shake things up in the Des Moines Public School System. He has long been an outspoken advocate of personal responsibility on the part of parents, students and administrators/bureaucrats.
Sure, Jon can be a bit self important at times, but I believe that he holds the best interests of our school system at heart though at times he stumbles. And when he does, the old time school board members and the Des Moines Ragister leap to discredit Narcisse through articles such as this one.
Jon was elected to the school board two years ago and is known as being v~e~r~y outspoken. Sure the BJ thing was a bit over the top, but it got the publicity that Jon was seeking.
Central Iowa Bart
PS: I sure would like to see Rachel’s writing on school vouchers, as I have no children and yet 65% of my property taxes are confiscated by the local school district.
November 20th, 2008 at 2:22 amESTThere’s a difference between encouraging and coddling, Craig.
November 20th, 2008 at 2:49 amESTI just have a few things to say here:
November 20th, 2008 at 5:06 amEST1. He’s lucky it’s only six weeks. If he were mine, he’s be out for the season.
2. If he was pushed into advanced mathematics, his parents are partially responsible. They could have said no.
3. He needs to spend more time in English composition anyway. Screw the wrestling.
4. The complaints and comments going to the newspaper are probably all his wrestling buddies from school posting under other names.
“Life isn’t fair.”
November 20th, 2008 at 6:30 amESTSez who?
My Daddy, gone now, said, “The harder you work, the more fair life becomes.”
It’s taken me years and experience to appreciate that.
He also used to quote (I think) Thomas Edison, “The harder I work, the luckier I get.”
I’m in the midst of lots of conversations like this with my feckless freshmen. Yesterday, when one Long Island Barbie was complaining about her grade, because she didn’t ‘understand’ the assignment (and never came by office hours, and turned in 600 words instead of 1000, didn’t turn in a draft, etc…) I ended the conversation with ,”Well, you fucked up.” I’m sure her parents were calling the dean within the hour.
November 20th, 2008 at 6:55 amESTCasey and dirtyrottenvarmit are simply daily kos type trolls who infect common sense blogs like Rachels. They are the lowest form of life possible (and that is being generous) and exist mainly to tear down all that is good, healthy, and honest in America. One of the reasons I like your blog Rachel is that you usually delete troll comments before we see them. Keep up the good work!
November 20th, 2008 at 7:02 amESTDRV says:
You cannot be serious. Some of the best discussion threads here are ones in which some us, including me, disagreed with Rachel. Vigorously. In fact, if I had to hazard a guess, I’d say that we still disagree about those things. No matter how much I disagreed with her, though, I took care never to call her, or others like her, such helpful things as “stupid”, “idiots”, “morons”, or [insert pejorative here].
Right now you might be searching for my name and you will discover that I have been less than civil with some people here. Aha! I must be a hypocrite!!! Uh no. At those times, I was replying to dickheads who added nothing to a discussion except for gratuitous insults and name calling. I actually then apologized to Rachel for pooping in her sandbox, to which she replied, “Hey, if someone wants to insult you, flame away.” She’s cool like that. But if I had started dropping crap on people and/or Rachel indiscriminately, well, let’s just say that I would expect to have everyone here ream me out.
I’m rambling here; it’s morning, and I suck in the mornings. Anyway, if you want to disagree with anyone here, or say that we’re wrong, do so. Even become heated, because some topics rightly inflame our passions. Just think a bit before you start a flamewar here because (a) it’s not a way to persuade anyone, (b) Rachel can permanently ban your ass and (c) no one here will hesitate to mercilessly mock and hound you around the Innertubes. If you want your name to show up as the #1-#20 searches for “douchetool”, flame away. If, however, you actually want disagree and debate, I, at least, am more than willing to go toe to toe with you. But be sure that you do not dis our hostess here by saying things such as “Do you only want comments that flatter you and agree with your viewpoint?” because you make yourself look simple. Also, you will have noticed that I replied to your post (okay, Casey’s, but they look almost the same) at length without resorting to ad hominem attacks. In fact, about the only thing you said that actually aggravated me was your stupid slap at Rachel, because it’s not only stupid, it’s obviously untrue. She’s more than capable of fighting her own battles- really, she IS- but I’m more than willing to kick some ass when I think that she’s been unfairly maligned. My guess is that most people piling on here in the comments feel the same way because we respect Rachel. We’d like to treat you with respect too, but you make that entirely too difficult when your arguments devolve into what resembles a DU thread. So knock it off, act right, and argue your point vigorously. Do that without acting like a jackass and we’ll get along famously. Do otherwise and, well, to quote Bruce Banner:
Don’t make me angry. You wouldn’t like me when I’m (we’re) angry.
November 20th, 2008 at 8:15 amEST[I'm sorry this is so long. I really did edit a lot out after I previewed it the first time. I just can't imagine what else I'd cut!]
All right, given the nature of a good part of this disagreement, I looked up the Des Moines Curriculum. I am a former High School Math teacher, so I can read this thing pretty well. Let me explain what the “Algebra II” class this kid took actually is.
It is not what we tend to think of when we say “Algebra II.” It is NOT advanced. It does not appear to deal with things like division of polynomials, imaginary numbers (like i), complex numbers, radical expressions, and so on.
Instead, it is an “Integrated Algebra” course, which, based on reading the curriculum goals and on my own experience with a very similar program, I can tell you that it is a JOKE. It is a combination of basic statistics, basic geometry, basic trig, and what most of the commenters here would probably remember as Algebra I from their high school days. So, calling it an advanced class is just simply right out.
Now, DRV, I have to call you out on this: we assign our children the task of going to school. They must be there for roughly the same amount of time that a person goes to work, and they are required to perform tasks or receive bad evaluations and/or some form of punishment. The comparisons between school and work are not out of line. Of course it is not a perfect comparison, nor is it meant to be. You missed the point, possibly intentionally, because the example didn’t line up exactly, like a man who claims an off-the-rack suit is not well-made because it wasn’t tailored for his body. Not surprising, but a little annoying in your condescension.
Furthermore, failing a class is NOT an accepted method of learning. Failing to understand a concept, or to successfully complete homework is one thing, but to fail a class is to show that the child did not have the prerequisite knowledge required, didn’t understand something in class and did not go to the teacher or a tutor for assistance, or simply didn’t care enough about the course to try. Failing a class is UNACCEPTABLE. Using a heart surgery example is beyond asinine at this point, as the generic “job” and school have far more in common than school and heart surgery.
As for the part about the school’s policies, may I remind you that every school district has a Code of Behavior in which rules for sports eligibility are usually included? And given that the child mentioned the rules in his own email, the school board member had no need to remind the student of the rules. Simply quoting the bureaucratic rules at the child would do no good. The school board member was trying to reach the kid, and tell him that this is less about following the rules than about what’s really best for that child.
Does the school board have the “right” to decide what’s best for the kid? Actually, they have been given that authority. They decide on what curriculum to buy, what the hiring practices will be, what days the kids are allowed to stay home from school, and school officials routinely talk about the best interests of the child. They have been given the mandate by the parents of determining what is best for the child, and then acting in accordance with that determination.
I happen to wholeheartedly despise this and will never send my children to a school, because I do not believe that strangers could possibly do a better job raising my children than I can. But when you ship your kids off to a school, that’s what your signing up for. You are allowing other people a voice in what’s best for your child. And no rational person would ever equate academics and wrestling.
November 20th, 2008 at 10:11 amESTI echo what TOK just said. DRV and Casey miss the whole point of this sordid episode: young Mr. Richman failed a class, and in full knowledge of his failure, sought to have the rules changed just for him. We can debate semantics about whether a class is advanced or not (and by my lights, which are admittedly dim, it’s not a hard class), but the fact is that Craig f***** up, and then cried “Woe is me” when he couldn’t get satisfaction from a school board that he assumed to be sympathetic.
Two things:
1. His assumption that the SB would bend the rules indicates that either it has happened in the past, or he is delusional. One reflects poorly on the previous boards (but kudos to them for holding the line), and the other reflects poorly on Richman. Now, seeing his whiny response about adults failing to encourage him, and his enabling parents’ bitching to the media, leads me to believe that this a symptom both of a system that rewards failure for certain athletes, and that he is a self-involved POS who does not comprehend that life is not easy.
2. His parents need to get a clue. They clearly do not have their s*** together, nor does their son. This is not about Narcisse’s admittedly poor choice of words. This is about the fact that when their snowflake didn’t get bailed out, they cried to the media, using the “blow job” reference as a strawman to attack the school board.
I’m going to go out a limb here and state that this isn’t even about the Richmans and Narcisse. This is about a generation of Baby Boomer parents who so fervently believe that their children are special that they will consistently enable them to underachieve, yet expect the world. I am 24 years old and very successful for this stage in my life. My wife is 23, and also advancing rapidly in the business world. Why? Because we both bust our asses. We long since passed the Craig Richmans of our age group, and we mock them for their failure to excel. That is a cruel thing to say, but the sooner they understand that it is only by hard work and a steady desire to learn and improve, will things break in their favor. Until then, I will look down on Craig’s underachieving ass and despise his parents for their soft love of low expectations. They should thank Narcisse for his advice, not attempt a media-driven crucifixion.
November 20th, 2008 at 10:35 amESTOooh. physics geek is off to a fine start this morning. I wonder how much is a reaction to the price of the ammo he was out buying yesterday.
btw I like you when you’re angry.
[Disclosure: I didn't buy ammo yesterday. But the day before I sang a Benjamin on a box of '-06, a box of 22-250, a box of 9mm (gift for the kids) and a brick of 22LR for general principles. Oh, and a bottle of #9 not for huffing purposes.]
November 20th, 2008 at 10:35 amESTNNTG:
Got my boxes of Rem Sluggers in 12 and 20 ga, 100 rds of WWB .38SP (both at Wally) and picked up 2 bricks of 22LR at my gun dealer just for the hell of it. Now, I need to convince the wife to let me get a Steyr M9-A1 and a Mossy Mariner with that sweet satin nickel Marinecote finish and a 18.5″ barrel. Ooooohhhh, the humanity. I cannot wait to bitterly cling to them.
November 20th, 2008 at 10:45 amESTPhysics Geek: I like you when you’re angry, too. Clearly, DRV, who claims to have been reading my blog for a long time, either made that up or doesn’t, in fact, read very well. If I only allowed comments that flatter me or agree with me, there’d be about 75% fewer comments around here. Try the politics and religion category threads, DRV.
Original Kit: Thank you for doing that research. Perfect! And it exactly proves the entire point most of us are trying to make here. Not an advanced class. Tough shit for the snowflake.
There are lots of other good comments here. Oh how I wish I had unlimited time so that I could respond to every comment that I wanted to. I really, really like all of you regulars. You make blogging fun.
November 20th, 2008 at 10:55 amESTI’d envision the real Rachel-as-Blogmistress outfit is more like, oh, maybe slacks/t-shirt. And socks. Lots of socks. No leather from the ankles up. This stuff is more fulfilling than the original topic, which is by now beaten to death. Diminishing returns and all that.
November 20th, 2008 at 11:10 amESTRachel Lucas Says:
Rachel, one of my biggest disappointments back at your earlier incarnation was when you decided to close comments due to the growing number of trolls and assholes. I would hate for you to do so again. Us little regulars would miss- horribly- the conversations with you, as well as each other, which is one of the many reasons that most of us keep it civil. Most of the time; we all have our moments.
And now I have to go do some actual work. Bah. I cannot for the life of figure out why they won’t simply pay me a salary and let me surf the web full time. It’s almost like they expect me to…earn my money. ::shudder::
And now I’ll try to embed an image:
Hit preview and…
Nope. Okay, I’ll break my rule and link to something amusing at my site. It kind of typifies my response to this whole mess, and it’s seasonal to boot.
I need to start uploading these things to image shack or something so that I can embed them here. Linking to myself here actually bugs me.
Maybe I’ve grown stupid, but cannot I not use
[img src="insert image URL here"]
(replace brackets with greater than/less than symbols)
to embed images? I think that I used it in the past, although I kind of broke the post with the alligator picture. Hmm. Maybe there’s a lesson there somewhere. In any event, I’ll take any advice on it. I’m currently working on breaking the restrictions on the newest commercial DVDs to make backup copies, and it’s taking up my time at home. For the record, the Memorex DL DVDs suck. Big time. So much so that I want to bring Ella Fitzgerald back from the dead so that I can bitch at her for hawking their products many years ago.
Huh. That last paragraph wasn’t off topic at all. It’s like I’ve developed a case of bloggy ADD. Ooh, look at the pretty bird!
November 20th, 2008 at 11:21 amESTFlyover,
November 20th, 2008 at 11:23 amESTI’m inclined to view a shotgun as more a close-in home defense weapon. In this house, there’s usually target loads about. If anything, the 7-1/2’s are more appropriate for urban-type use; less chance of injuring bystanders. Furthermore, how much difference does it really make? Guy hearing businesslike 870-closing kerclunk whilst looking in the wrong end has no clue what just went into the chamber.
Awesome Tape #6; if you are looking for a place in San Diego, I lived many years in what is called the “golden triangle”, and highly recommend the area. it is between the 5, 52, and the 805 freeways. University City is the place.
November 20th, 2008 at 11:27 amESTHmm. How far UP were you thinking??? Maybe as far as the- ::SLAP!!::
Sorry. I was thinking ahead to the “Denna” episode of Legend of the Seeker. I cannot seem to get the image of a hot chick wearing skin tight red leather out of my mind.
November 20th, 2008 at 11:29 amESTRoger that. The Rem Sluggers are for deer murder. Shotgun season opens tomorrow, and we have at least two big ‘uns roaming our killing fields. I love my little 20ga 1100, but I’ve also got a Mossy 500 Slugger and an 1100 3″ Mag for the really violent deer ;). For home defense, I’ve got a Winchester 1300 pump and a SW Mod 66 with a 4″ barrel, loaded with .38Sp. hollowpoints. The Winny takes #4 shot, and you’re right on about the sound of a pump action snapping closed. It scares the s*** out of any rational person, but we live in a rented house, so its use is not advised unless the S has truly HTF.
I prefer the SW66 with the .38 JHP. My wife, however, hates it (too heavy, and to her, a shotgun is preferable…plus, she shot some .357 out of it, and now she won’t go anywhere near it). Next purchase is a smallish 9mm for her, and maybe a range bunny for me. Hell, might even be the same gun.
November 20th, 2008 at 12:08 pmESTOh. Cat-Avoids-Cold-Stove Syndrome. That’s usually not worth arguing about. Get the lady something she can be comfy with. One of my Rules of Happy Marriage is Have it Her Way. The best way to handle arguments between spouses is to avoid them.
Uuuh, how far up is that? I was thinking of allowing Rachel to wear shoes, too.
Are MAMT#6 and I not as confused as we think, and between us more right about you than we thought? I thought we thought you were actually more, well, normal, and just poking a little good-natured fun.
November 20th, 2008 at 12:33 pmESTWoops I meant to avoid the argument, not the spouse. Antecedent <- pronoun.
November 20th, 2008 at 12:43 pmESTDang skippy. The funny thing is, she’s lights-out with a 12ga. The trophy bucks on the wall, and my frazzled ego at clay shoots, will attest to that. She shoots a Winchester Model 12 (her gpa’s gun), mule-kick and all. Guess a handgun is a different beast to slay…I grew up shooting handguns, and have shot everything from a .22 to a SW 500, so little frightens me there.
The little 9mm Europellet ought to be fine for her, especially in a service-size pistol. The old man has an XD9 4″, and its a great gun…low recoil, decent trigger, hi-cap. I prefer the Ruger bricks, or the SR9, to Springers (mostly on cost). It’s gonna be a while before I can graduate her to the greatest gun ever made, the 1911.
And I’ve long since learned that If The Wife Ain’t Happy, No One Is. Thanks for the advice, btw. Being young and all, I’ve got a life chock-full of f***ups in front of me. Any knowledge gained now will minimize the self-inflicted pain later on.
November 20th, 2008 at 1:02 pmESTFlyover Country, in that case, another bit of subversive free advice.
Your wife surely has other grown women within her circle of acquaintence. Devote time to study the behavior of their consorts and endeavor to be at least a tiny bit better husband than the best of them. [This doesn't necessarily mean making more money.] That makes you the standard of comparison and undercuts a lot of bitching.
Domestic tranquility is important. That’s why it’s in The Constitution.
November 20th, 2008 at 1:16 pmESTNNTG, is this coming from a life of hard-won experience?
I like the idea…fortunately, most of her friends’ significant others are tools. It’s a rather low standard to achieve, akin to bathing once a week and not asking a mother-in-law to pull one’s finger. Now, my friends…overachievers, all of them. And the wife’s friends themselves are exceptional people, who just happen to have poor taste in dudes. In my age bracket, though, that’s fairly common. I think one of the “other” guys is a wrestler who’s been made a fool of on the interwebs…something to do with school boards and blow jobs.
Thanks for the advice, though. God knows I’m dysfunctional enough to need other people’s input.
November 20th, 2008 at 1:43 pmESTOf course, if that group of consorts also defines your pool of potential friends then raising the bar on them makes for some lonely Super-Bowl Sundays.
I’m not saying it’s not worth it. And if you manage the defecit at a low level, you can usually make up for it with beer and wings.
Being rich trumps all of the above.
November 20th, 2008 at 1:55 pmESTOkay, I think I can add some perspective as both my kids have gone to the high school in question. In fact, my youngest - who is on the swim team - was not allowed to participate in post season events as he flunked a math class his 1st Semester last year.
1st on the no pass no play rule. It’s a good one. It certainly motivated my boy who (rightly) felt that he had let his teammates down.
2nd - on the question of the school board member - although I agree with pretty much everything in his email minus the blowjob thing, this man has the reputation of something of a crazy to people across the political spectrum.
Local reaction…? As far as I can tell, opinion seems to be “a plague on all your houses”. The school board guy is being taken to task primarily for the naughty language. The boy is being criticized for wanting special rules applied to him. I think the parents are fairing worst of all for all of the reasons Rachel brought up.
Anyway, that’s the news from Des Moines, where all of the children are unfortunately NOT above average.
November 20th, 2008 at 2:21 pmEST36 years. Only about 2/3 of a life. Experience was not hard-won. I credit myself for being smart and figuring some stuff out early on. Marrying a smart girl helped. The hard-won part was outliving her. I miss her and I’m still not over that.
The “Why are the Good Ones all Married?” syndrome. The why is, some women were smart enough to spot, and snatch (several senses of term) the “Good Ones” early on. And not let go.
I wonder if there’s a Darwinian aspect, and women “enjoy” a share of blame. If you invent a better mousetrap, Nature will invent better mice. If women evolved better taste in men, better men would leave more offspring. Anecdotal: In nearly every case observed of husbands complaining about their stupid wives, those wives really should have sought smarter husbands.
November 20th, 2008 at 2:40 pmESTMy poor wife has to put up with the occasional boorish behavior, road rage and random insults hurled at the television. It has to be something like living with House, except I’m half as smart and fully 100% less funny.
NNTG, I am very sorry to have inadvertently made light of your loss. You’re absolutely right - marrying a smart women has been my life’s joy. She’s also nicer than me, funnier than me, is (admittedly) a better shot than me with a long gun and is considerably more attractive and likable. I thank the good Lord every day for her, and it’s my life’s goal to be a good husband now and ever, and a good father someday.
I experienced the “Good Guy” syndrome firsthand during my formative years, then due to my own anger at many things, became a total a-hole by college. To my surprise, I started to get attention from the fairer sex. It baffled me, but I wasn’t going to question Mother Nature. Eventually, I met the Future Mrs. Flyover Country, who completely saw through my s***, tolerated it, and finally helped me grow up. I’m a better man for it.
BTW, I showed her this thread and article, and the Wife believes that Craig should be beaten about the head with a math textbook until he (her words) “osmosizes that knowledge right into his stupid monkey-brain.” I think her and Rachel Lucas would be friends.
November 20th, 2008 at 3:06 pmESTFlyover, rest thy Conscience. I see no reason to be offended.
But I would sally there at least were some good ones around. Many of this very group appear to be contentedly-married ladies. Or maybe this is a Selection Factor caused by Rachel attracting better women. /schmooze
November 20th, 2008 at 3:16 pmESTDr. FG, I hear you. Every individual to whom I sent contributions in 2006 LOST. That included some poor sod in your neck of the woods and Michael Steele in Maryland. This year, same deal. All the ‘Pubs lost. How in the heck does Grassley hang in there?
Furthermore, might I suggest to some of the more wordy and logic-impaired to favor all by using bullet points.
November 20th, 2008 at 3:26 pmESTAs one I can boldly say, contentedly married women are typically found with men who behave like men including some bads to complement the many goods.
November 20th, 2008 at 3:29 pmESTDr. FG, forgot. Steve King won. I didn’t contribute to his campaign however because he already had quite the war chest.
November 20th, 2008 at 3:31 pmESTThank You P.G.
That’s exactly what I termed her projection on. It seems she needs a positive to prove a positive.
Anyway, I had to go out, and could not answer her directly.
So…Thank You!
November 20th, 2008 at 5:05 pmESTHi Rachel.
Me too. It is good advice that mixes the pros and cons of sucking it up.
Maybe Obama will prevent this sort of conflict when he makes King and King required course work for four year olds all around the world. I’d prefer he solve the NCAA division one BCS championship controversy first, but, hey what do I know? I didn’t get any votes this year representing the Opium Party. THANKS A LOT.
If this self appointed gift to the world of a student can’t successfully proof read a letter intended to showcase his giftedness, the parents should simply shut up and hope it goes away before it is SPLATTERED ALL OVER THE INTERNET. He made the case against himself by sending THAT as his defense.
If my boy acted like “what is a blow job” and all that BULLSHIT about being offended by such language I’D HAVE TO REMOVE HIM FROM HIGH SCHOOL GLORY SPORTS. Cuz, really, what kind of pussy ass kid doesn’t know what a fucking blow job is?
If my son is sixteen years old and asks me anything as naive as “Dad, what’s a blow job?” or he tells me that he is offended by such discourse after all of the fucking shit that was already shoved down his throat since he started school, and I thought he was serious, I might have to say “Probably ten bucks, at least that what it was when I was your age. Fuck it. Here’s twenty, Jack. Just don’t get one from Randy.”
At any rate, I agree, I am with the school board guy on this one too. I have no problem whatsoever with anything he said. Hell, I like the approach. I might print that letter and use just in case Jack gets older and FAILS at something and tries to cry his way out of it like a fucking two-year-old.
Raising teenagers is going to be a fucking BITCH.
November 20th, 2008 at 7:09 pmESTThis should be required reading for all those little dears who cannot separate needs from wants and proritize things. For all those special people who cannot distinguish rights from privileges….follow up by watching “Less than Zero”. See Iron Man
November 23rd, 2008 at 5:25 pmESTat his less than best. Could be worse, instead of begging for a blow job he coulda been a chickenhawk for blow.